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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65298
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fandango
some birds lay their eggs right on the sand at isolated beaches. the eggs look like small rocks. looks like the chicks look like a shell or rock as
well. did this one survive the vehicles on the beach?
[img]http:// [/img] |
Yes, it did...
Like my photo... ? The close up is in this year's Baja Calendar (December)... and you all can enjoy it because we got to our campsite there by the
only way, on the beach... a beach not in any town or with any people... like most in Baja.
The photos of that trip are at http://vivabaja.com/508 (May, 2008).
[Edited on 1-27-2009 by David K]
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viabaja
Nomad
Posts: 277
Registered: 10-6-2003
Location: Georgia
Member Is Offline
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Good comments! DavidK has some good photos. Drive only in the tide zone and avoid the dunes & high beach. Go around people slowly. Put the
mufflers back in the exhausts ,etc. Common sense & courtesy which alot of people LACK - on both sides of the border, has given ATV's a bad rap.
They are useful tools (mine are the utility type) that make Baja enjoyable and fishing available. Without a boat (still have to cross the beach to
launch), it's near impossible to fish 3 to 4 miles of remote beach without a Jeep or quad to carry one's gear. When and if they start really enforcing
that rule of no driving and others in the federal zone which has been on the books for years, it will be time to say hasta la vista!
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65298
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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10-4 viabaja... kind of hard to carry your fishing tackel and the fish you caught from the fishing spot back 4 miles to camp... by hand and foot!
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
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Laws aren't made for your convenience ...
Or to be followed only when someone's looking
| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
10-4 viabaja... kind of hard to carry your fishing tackel and the fish you caught from the fishing spot back 4 miles to camp... by hand and foot! |
If not driving on the beach means it becomes impossible to fish or camp remote places... then you don't.
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
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Dave the spoiler! Look we've rehashed this a number of times.
Be a prudent guest and if you can't get the hell out.
DON\'T SQUINT! Give yer eyes a break!
Try holding down [control] key and toggle the [+ and -] keys
Viva Mulege!
Nomads\' Sunsets
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65298
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Then we have little or no reason to go to Baja!
It is the remote beach camping that has us going as much as we do, because it is unique to Baja and we have no equivelent here. The great outdoor life
is what draws me to Baja... and most I hope (fishing, camping, off roading, hiking...)
Baja offers different things to different people... seems a few here go to Baja to live cheaper or stay out of the grips of Uncle Sam... for others it
is the simpler life with less restrictions on personal freedom. A few go to a place they love because it is different, then try to impose their
beliefs on everyone else after they move there...???!
I am sure the people of Baja enjoy the income provided by campers traveling south... as well.
What's next, a ban on off road racing??? Do you know the financial impact that would have on an already hurting economy?
The purpose of laws should be to protect people from harm... Driving on city beaches... crowded places... could harm someone... Driving on deserted
beaches to get to a camping spot (not running up and down it to make noise or tear it up), hurts no one.
My inner soul has a connection to Baja... or Old California, as it really is... Baja was California FIRST... and I feel 'right' when I am in Baja...
on the beach, on the Camino Real, in a palm canyon, exploring mission ruins and Indian rock art sites. I got a vehicle that can take me to all those
places. I am not tied to paved or graded roads...
I have camped on Shell Island since 1978... If someone reads my posts or sees my photos, I share here and doesn't like it, all I can say is find some
happiness of your own instead of trying to steal mine.
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comitan
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4177
Registered: 3-27-2004
Location: La Paz
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow
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Strive For The Ideal, But Deal With What\'s Real.
Every day is a new day, better than the day before.(from some song)
Lord, Keep your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth.
“The sincere pursuit of truth requires you to entertain the possibility that everything you believe to be true may in fact be false”
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65298
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Thank you comitan... 
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dtbushpilot
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3296
Registered: 1-11-2007
Location: Buena Vista BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Tranquilo
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It really is simple. If you have an issue with driving on the beach, don't do it. No one will chastize you for not doing it.....dt
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ArroyoTaxi
Junior Nomad
Posts: 88
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Los Barriles
Member Is Offline
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It's all about the A**Hole Factor
There are people who respectfully scoot down to the water and drop off their boats. There are people who race up and down the beach every morning and
wake us all up. Just like there are people who walk their dogs and scoop up the poo and people who kick sand over the poo every day. Baja is just like
everywhere else. There are really awesome people and really gross people. There are people who respect their neighbors, there are people who light up
cigarettes at the taco stand and blow billows of smoke while our children are eating at the next table. There are people who check on their
neighbor's homes, there are people who leave their cars idleing in front of outdoor restaurants. We choose to hang with the awesome people. It is the
same everywhere. The ATV situation is so clear - the A**holes are inconsiderate and pollute the beach with fumes and noise and most people can't stand
them. The considerate ATV people fly under everyone's radar because if they want to scream around, they go up the arroyo. It's really that simple.
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: |
if they want to scream around, they go up the arroyo.
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Like an ArroyoTaxi?
DON\'T SQUINT! Give yer eyes a break!
Try holding down [control] key and toggle the [+ and -] keys
Viva Mulege!
Nomads\' Sunsets
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Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Then we have little or no reason to go to Baja!
It is the remote beach camping that has us going as much as we do, because it is unique to Baja and we have no equivelent here. The great outdoor life
is what draws me to Baja... and most I hope (fishing, camping, off roading, hiking...)
Baja offers different things to different people... seems a few here go to Baja to live cheaper or stay out of the grips of Uncle Sam... for others it
is the simpler life with less restrictions on personal freedom. A few go to a place they love because it is different, then try to impose their
beliefs on everyone else after they move there...???!
I am sure the people of Baja enjoy the income provided by campers traveling south... as well.
What's next, a ban on off road racing??? Do you know the financial impact that would have on an already hurting economy?
The purpose of laws should be to protect people from harm... Driving on city beaches... crowded places... could harm someone... Driving on deserted
beaches to get to a camping spot (not running up and down it to make noise or tear it up), hurts no one.
My inner soul has a connection to Baja... or Old California, as it really is... Baja was California FIRST... and I feel 'right' when I am in Baja...
on the beach, on the Camino Real, in a palm canyon, exploring mission ruins and Indian rock art sites. I got a vehicle that can take me to all those
places. I am not tied to paved or graded roads...
I have camped on Shell Island since 1978... If someone reads my posts or sees my photos, I share here and doesn't like it, all I can say is find some
happiness of your own instead of trying to steal mine. |
Good on you Dave- as they say downunder! Nice post. 
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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longlegsinlapaz
Super Nomad
Posts: 1685
Registered: 11-18-2005
Location: La Paz
Member Is Offline
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It never ceases to amaze me how some justify their actions because things are different in Mexico, or because locals ignore the laws
of their own country, or too far to hike, too much to carry, or (insert personal justification here)!
Virtually everyone who posted here acknowledged knowing it's illegal to drive on Mexican beaches; some in their egotistical
self-interest have attempted to question why the laws were REALLY written, what they REALLY mean, how they're REALLY meant to be applied, assume
because the laws aren't always strictly enforced that they don't really apply to THEM! The arrogance of second-guessing what/where/who/why a foreign
(to most of us) country's law REALLY exists reflects a total lack of respect for the law & the country. Even those who acknowledge turtles nest
on these beaches, bird lay eggs & hatch on these sands...out of one side of their mouth, then justify why it's okay for them to break the law,
because their somehow exempt or special or that they simply don't give a damn about the law, nor the species they may be written to protect, the logic
behind the law...out of the other side of their mouth!
Most beach drivers who posted appear to condone breaking Mexican laws. Their posts come across as though they feel they're above the law, they're
somehow exempt, the mentality of encouraging others to violate laws under the guise that if locals don't honor the law, then gringos can't or won't be
held accountable is the height of arrogance to me.
As guests in Mexico, we have no right to challenge the laws, nor pick & choose those we're willing to comply with, based on our personal
convenience. The prevalent mentality that it's Mexico & things are different in Mexico, so we can do whatever we damn well please & the
hell with the laws, environment, other peoples rights, wildlife (be they endangered species or not).
What part of IT'S THE LAW, applicable to ALL, regardless of how evenly it's enforced is it so hard for many to grasp? Or is it simply
self-serving arrogance? <<rhetorical question, since I've already read the personal "justifications"!
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dtbushpilot
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3296
Registered: 1-11-2007
Location: Buena Vista BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Tranquilo
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I'm well aware that riding my ATV on the beach is illegal. I try to be considerate as possible of others while I enjoy my life in Baja. If I am
punished for my crime I will accept my punishment, pay my fine, not complain or expect any sympathy....just like when I get a speeding ticket here in
the USA....dt
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Paula
Super Nomad
Posts: 2219
Registered: 1-5-2006
Location: Loreto
Member Is Offline
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Originally posted by soulpatch
| Quote: | Hey Longlegs,
I think most on here would agree that we are guests in Mexico and that we are not above Mexico's people. However, it seems like most Mexicans have
disregard for many of their laws and who are we to be superior to them? |
A giant soft pretzel goes to soulpatch, winner of the twisted logic award
edit: to take myself out of the box
[Edited on 1-28-2009 by Paula]
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Packoderm
Super Nomad
Posts: 2116
Registered: 11-7-2002
Member Is Offline
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Isn't it illegal to take clams or even shells from the shoreline in Mexico? Wouldn't it be considered a blatant disregard of our own upstanding if any
of us gringos were to go clamming? Would it be right to punish an FM3 holding gringo who owns a vacation or retirement home with a fine in excess of
hundreds of U.S. dollars for clamming or allowing a grand daughter to collect shells? I would venture to guess that clamming would be more disruptive
to the shore's ecosystem than cruising along on the wet sand on a quad. I bet that the ATV ban would have never even come to be if the vacation homes
didn't get built along the shorelines. Yet on this site I read about these same people who own the homes going out clamming. If you want us to swear
off riding on the beach, wouldn't you need to buy your clams and shells from an authorized retailer?
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
Member Is Offline
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Longlegs has it exactly right. There is a pervasive feeling that because we are in Mexico, laws are not as official as at home. Frankly, I think it's
a sort of soft bigotry. We are guests. We ought to respect the laws, regardless of whether there are Mexicans who break the law. Just like at home.
Just because someone is speeding, doesn't justify everyone to speed.
[Edited on 1-28-2009 by Bajahowodd]
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Packoderm
Isn't it illegal to take clams or even shells from the shoreline in Mexico? Wouldn't it be considered a blatant disregard of our own upstanding if any
of us gringos were to go clamming? Would it be right to punish an FM3 holding gringo who owns a vacation or retirement home with a fine in excess of
hundreds of U.S. dollars for clamming or allowing a grand daughter to collect shells? I would venture to guess that clamming would be more disruptive
to the shore's ecosystem than cruising along on the wet sand on a quad. I bet that the ATV ban would have never even come to be if the vacation homes
didn't get built along the shorelines. Yet on this site I read about these same people who own the homes going out clamming. If you want us to swear
off riding on the beach, wouldn't you need to buy your clams and shells from an authorized retailer? |
Let me tell you something. The arrogance has gotten worse. These people who brag about their misdeeds are a new breed. I don't remember backslapping
ever being so common regarding their blatant touting.
They would be in a worldofchit if they behaved the same way in their northern neighborhoods.
Why broadcast your pompousness anyway? I guess it makes the head swell even more.
Arrogance=P-ince imho
DON\'T SQUINT! Give yer eyes a break!
Try holding down [control] key and toggle the [+ and -] keys
Viva Mulege!
Nomads\' Sunsets
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Packoderm
Super Nomad
Posts: 2116
Registered: 11-7-2002
Member Is Offline
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Please explain how my comparison of poaching clams to riding ATVs on the beach is arrogant. It's just a small thing I ask, but how is comparing
poaching clams to riding ATVs on the beach possibly seen as arrogant? I don't see how it is so. In the U.S.A. people who poach wildlife would be in
much more in a worldofchit than riding off road vehicles where they're not supposed to. Anyway, I'm an environmentalist and would be in favor of a
plan to guard against damage to the coastline if done in a fair and sensible manner, but if some want to ban ATVs due to the noise and nuisance
factor, I wish they would just be honest and state so. I don't see how trucks loading pangas cause less damage than cruising along the wet part of the
beach on a quad - which I have never confessed to doing. It's like how a while back they tried to close down a topless bar because it didn't have
handicapped access for dancers to get on stage. They weren't concerned about any possible dancers in wheelchairs - they just didn't want girls dancing
naked. I sense the same sort of thing going on here. Anyway, when they build the mega resorts, all concern for the environment will be out the window.
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4baja
Super Nomad
Posts: 1339
Registered: 9-4-2003
Location: morro bay ca
Member Is Offline
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think ill drive my quad down the beach and get some clams to eat, man that sounds good!
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