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tripledigitken
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some of my best friends are illegals...........
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Barry A.
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
It is because I believe in the saying that no human being is illegal---and yes Dennis, I know you hate that saying.
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I do, Diane. I hate it because, in spite of the fact that it's technically meaningless, libs have grasped on to it and given it meaning with their
overly vocal acceptance of it as real.
It's placard nonsense which in all probabability would be long gone by now if not for those who think the term is viable although unacceptable. By
unanimous rejection of the term, it is being kept alive.
Tell your friends to not use that word anymore and it will atrophy away. |
What is meaningful, real and important is different to everyone---I will stick to undocumented, thank you. |
----but, but, but------by using the word 'undocumented' you are doing what you were criticising others of doing in an earlier post---namely making
statements out of context-----"undocumented" does not tell the full story, and is therefore inherently misleading and, like Dennis says, meaningless.
Human beans are not "illegal"---the act they commited is illegal!!!
When you break the law (usually a personal choice), you must except the consequences----to do otherwise is compounding the illegal act, and that will
bite you big time in the USA Judicial system as we know it, as it should. To follow your logic seems to me to make "laws" a joke, thus erroding the
very civilization and society that we have so painfully built up over the years in this Country. It ain't perfect, for sure, but it is the best going
so far.
Barry
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tripledigitken
some of my best friends are illegals........... |
We have been considering returning to Honduras for a year and we will once again be undocumented workers----we refuse to be illegals, however.
Went back and read that blog again----even more interesting knowing who the author is-
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wessongroup
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Undocumented = not in the Untied States legally therefor the individual can do nothing legally: drive a car, get insurance, by a home, get social
security, pay property taxes, pay payroll taxes, the list goes on... and oh, one other... get a job and work legally in the United States = Illegal
One may not "like" it... but, it is the current law of the United States of America, which makes these and individuals illegal when they walk across
the border without "proper" documentation.
Words don't really make that much difference when someone is being picked up and taken back to Mexico.. they call it getting caught... most don't get
into a discussion over getting busted... was talking with a guy that got kicked out just a couple years ago .. He only wants to be able to apply to go
across, but he got caught twice and he says he can't EVER go back ... which I don't think is fair... if he puts in his application, and does what is
asked he should be able to get the proper documentation and go back to the States.. he had a family with 5 children, his wife is driving them daily
across to school, as they were born in the States. I have not read the law, but it sounds more like policy... welcome answers in that area from anyone
.... it would sure help this family out.. if this guy can make a living in Rosarito.. he can anywhere, given a chance...
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tripledigitken
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I just read the original post.
We spent a few days in Patzcuaro and the surrounding countryside. The last thing that occured to me whilst taking in that beautiful part of the world
filled with art and culture was............"poverty".
This "Gringo" takes offense to much of his post.
And yes, knowing his background brings some clarity to his point of view.
Ken
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DENNIS
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Ok...Ok...Ok...........no more illegal alien. From now on we'll call them, "Guests in the US currently in a state of illegalness."
GITUSCIASOI
Can't wait to see Janet Murgia walking up and down the street with that placard over her reconquista shoulder.
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comitan
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I think that it comes down to is easy money, at least easier than Mexico, where there is very little poverty in my estimation of 27 years bumming
around Mexico.
Strive For The Ideal, But Deal With What\'s Real.
Every day is a new day, better than the day before.(from some song)
Lord, Keep your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth.
“The sincere pursuit of truth requires you to entertain the possibility that everything you believe to be true may in fact be false”
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comitan
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This interpretation works for me. (Excerpt)
Much has been written about the meaning of poverty. What we find through our work and frequent visits to poor communities is that poverty:
* deprives people of their security and well-being;
* deprives people not only of safe water and adequate food, clothing and shelter, but also education and healthcare;
* takes away people’s rights, and their freedom, dignity and peace of mind;
* puts people's lives in danger and robs them of their future.
Of course, poverty is not just about physical deprivation, it is also about lack of opportunity and loss of hope (poverty of spirit) -- see what we
say about this in relation to countries in Eastern Europe.
The Scottish Poverty Information Unit argues that: "Poverty is defined relative to the standards of living in a society at a specific time. People
live in poverty when they are denied an income sufficient for their material needs and when these circumstances exclude them from taking part in
activities which are an accepted part of daily life in that society."
Strive For The Ideal, But Deal With What\'s Real.
Every day is a new day, better than the day before.(from some song)
Lord, Keep your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth.
“The sincere pursuit of truth requires you to entertain the possibility that everything you believe to be true may in fact be false”
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Barry A.
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"The Scottish Poverty Information Unit argues that: "Poverty is defined relative to the standards of living in a society at a specific time. People
live in poverty when they are denied an income sufficient for their material needs and when these circumstances exclude them from taking part in
activities which are an accepted part of daily life in that society."
The Amish and Menonites come to mind--------I have some problems with the second part of that definition. By that definition the "standard of
living" in THE HAMPTONS puts me in poverty, yet I don't feel like I am impoverished even when I am there on vacation (a friend of mind has a 2nd home
almost there), and I certainly don't feel deprived in any way.
I accept the first part, tho.
Barry
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Bajahowodd
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There's an amazing amount of poverty in the US. And to blame immigrants, legal or otherwise, is just ignoring the root cause of the problem. For at
least three, perhaps, four decades, our country has gradually, but inexorably been moving away from a middle class society and into something that the
third world has championed. Greed and hubris have redistributed the wealth, while at the same time, the so-called easy money of cheap loans and credit
served to mask what was happening. Typical mom and pop families didn't have a clue about what was happening. So-called risky loans, credit cards that
allowed a minimum monthly payment that really only served to enrich the bankers, an unrealistic and inexorable surge in real estate values, gave most
common folk the idea that the American dream was theirs. Truth is that is was a house of cards that obviously collapsed when finally, the most exotic
of financial industry programs imploded. Truth is that for perhaps thirty years, the US has been creating mythical wealth. While exporting well paying
(at least here) jobs to the third world, the supposed vacuum was being filled by business school graduates who were taught that they were gamers who
could seemingly create wealth in a casino environment. At the end of the day, if you don't have natural resources, if you don't manufacture stuff,
the so-called wealth is plainly ephemeral. Hello Wall Street.
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Barry A.
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Well, after some 45 years of investing in Stocks, Wall Street has certainly rewarded me with a comfortable living, my "American Dream", if you will.
75% of my income comes from my Stocks, and I enjoy it. We all get there in our own way, but a lot of folks that I see all around me are certainly
living the "American Dream", and many of us want to preserve the system that provided us the means to achieve it, and hold on to it.
Barry
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vandenberg
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
For at least three, perhaps, four decades, our country has gradually, but inexorably been moving away from a middle class society and into something
that the third world has championed. Greed and hubris have redistributed the wealth, while at the same time, the so-called easy money of cheap loans
and credit served to mask what was happening. Typical mom and pop families didn't have a clue about what was happening. So-called risky loans, credit
cards that allowed a minimum monthly payment that really only served to enrich the bankers, an unrealistic and inexorable surge in real estate values,
gave most common folk the idea that the American dream was theirs. |
Basically , this is an argument towards socialism, stating that most folks are not competent to handle every day's events rationally. Which means
government interference, to keep people safe from the bankers, Wall street and other society's leaches ?? Isn't working too well in Europe and
wherever it's been tried. I thoroughly believe education of the masses maybe the answer, although I"m afraid that the intelligence of the average
citizen would be taxed to it's limits.
[Edited on 5-17-2010 by vandenberg]
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bajaguy
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
We have been considering returning to Honduras for a year and we will once again be undocumented workers----we refuse to be illegals, however.
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I find it interesting you publically boast you are going to intentionally violate the immigration and employment laws of the soverign country of
Honduras. That is an illegal act, you will be in their country illegally which makes you an illegal.
Must be nice to pick and chose which laws you will obey.
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durrelllrobert
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| Quote: |
Barry, undocumented means "without papers". |
When most Italian immigrants landed at Ellis island in the 1900s their entry was stamped in the book as WOP which is a derogitory name for Italians
today just as Espada Mojadas (sp?)is a derogitory term for Mexicans that are in the US illegally. Let's not start calling the WOPs now
[Edited on 5-17-2010 by durrelllrobert]
Bob Durrell
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajaguy
| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
We have been considering returning to Honduras for a year and we will once again be undocumented workers----we refuse to be illegals, however.
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I find it interesting you publically boast you are going to intentionally violate the immigration and employment laws of the soverign country of
Honduras. That is an illegal act, you will be in their country illegally which makes you an illegal.
Must be nice to pick and chose which laws you will obey. |
Yes, we are considering doing it again. We were never in the country illegally, we just did not have the expensive papers they want for one to work,
so we were undocumented workers. 
And yes, I don't have a problem with it because the school would have to close down if it paid for all the paper work for the teachers. The local
immigration officer was very aware of the situation with the foreign teachers and chose not to do anything about it. He could have put a stop to it
any time he wanted --- he knew all of us.
I know a number of people who enter the US legally all the time, but they are undocumented workers. I have no problem with these workers.
So you are correct, this is one law I have chosen to ignore and am OK with having done so.
[Edited on 5-17-2010 by DianaT]
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
I know a number of people who enter the US legally all the time, but they are undocumented workers. I have no problem with these workers.
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If they are in country legally, how are they undocumented?
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
I know a number of people who enter the US legally all the time, but they are undocumented workers. I have no problem with these workers.
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If they are in country legally, how are they undocumented? |
They are here on travel, student or visiting visas---and they are from more than one other country.
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MrBillM
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Freedom and Equality
I, too, think that citizens of Mexico should be able to travel freely into and out of the United States as long as they have the proper documents and
financial resources to support themselves while "Visiting".
Come to think of it, they do NOW ! OR, all of those Mexican-plated vehicles filling up the Walmart and other parking lots are some
sort of an illusion.
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
They are here on travel, student or visiting visas---and they are from more than one other country. |
Well...shame on them. Don't they know they're gonna burn in Hell for eternity?
Oh...wait a minute. Are they in Yuma? 
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
They are here on travel, student or visiting visas---and they are from more than one other country. |
Well...shame on them. Don't they know they're gonna burn in Hell for eternity?
Oh...wait a minute. Are they in Yuma? |
Since we did the same thing in Central America, I guess we are also destined for the fires----where most of our friends are going to be anyway since I
hear there will only be 100,000 people in the other place.
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