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DENNIS
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Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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Quote: | Originally posted by bajalinda
Gotta say we much prefer this new service! |
I don't know how far back you go here, Linda, but to really appreciate what we have today, one had to live here in the old days. It was brutal the
way they, and the other utilities, treated their customers. It was absolute power abuse. [no pun intended]
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LaTijereta
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Posts: 1192
Registered: 8-27-2003
Location: Loreto
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You can read your bill here, about 4-5 days after they read your meter..
http://app.cfe.gob.mx/Aplicaciones/CCFE/Recibos/Consulta/log...
Very easy to get registered to log-in..
Democracy is like two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
Ben Franklin (1759)
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bajalinda
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Posts: 552
Registered: 6-7-2008
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
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Thanks, LaTijereta. We are signed up online with CFE and sometimes our bill does appear online before it's delivered here, but they usually both
appear around the same time.
Anyway, don't get me wrong, I'm NOT complaining. We think that CFE does a pretty good job - in fact, when we get a major storm rolling through these
parts and the power goes out......1 or 2 days later we see a CFE truck and agent arrive here checking to see that everything is back up and running.
And this without a service call in to them on our part - they know that service is out in the whole area and I'm often amazed at how quickly they
manage to get things back to normal.
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DaliDali
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Posts: 1132
Registered: 4-21-2010
Location: BCS
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Quote: | Originally posted by bajalinda
Thanks, LaTijereta. We are signed up online with CFE and sometimes our bill does appear online before it's delivered here, but they usually both
appear around the same time.
Anyway, don't get me wrong, I'm NOT complaining. We think that CFE does a pretty good job - in fact, when we get a major storm rolling through these
parts and the power goes out......1 or 2 days later we see a CFE truck and agent arrive here checking to see that everything is back up and running.
And this without a service call in to them on our part - they know that service is out in the whole area and I'm often amazed at how quickly they
manage to get things back to normal. |
Indeed, I appreciate their service.
A couple of years back, after a hurricane blasted El Valle and Loreto, knocking down the power lines from San Carlos northward, the CFE brought in
mobile diesel generators that turned the lights back on in Loreto. Albeit a week after, and my frozen goods had perished.
One could hear the cheers of relief throughout the town.
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Mula
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Posts: 1662
Registered: 8-16-2011
Location: San Nicolas y Lopez Mateos
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CFE are quick responders in Lopez Mateos.
We have frequent outages, but they are always quick to respond.
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laventana
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Posts: 216
Registered: 8-24-2006
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and claim they pay 4000 pesos a month in subsities but does that mean it is true?
Canada delivers electricity to their customers at 7 cents per kwh, usa average is about 11 cents, Hawaii is the most expensive, but they really do
not need AC. The wholesale price of electricity in the USA is about 4-6 cents per kwh. Production cost as someone noted Nuke about 2-4 cents,
coal and natural gas about 4-6 cents. fuel oil cost is about 8-10 cents. solar reflective concentrating 14 cents per kwh I think delivered by the
boulder city plant. Photovoltaic is about 30-40 cents.
Germany has one of the highest rates in the world is 40 cents per kwh retail.
Here in mexico if you hit your DAC rate it is over 4 pesos per kwh plus tax.
I have links to all these numbers if someone wants them. just ask.
I read my meter almost every other day. Have done so for 14 years and it is on a spreadsheet. Do it with water too. I have had some appliances
go bad (salt air is so nasty to electronics) that would have cost me significantly but caught the problem right away, and water line breaks that would
have been expensive, some people hit USD$2,000.00 water bills a month because of a pipe break they did not know about.
Thus this game of saying subsidized, again they could write 4000 pesos and or 1 million, well at those people would figure it out. I bet Carlos is
involved somehow... hahahaha
[Edited on 6-24-2013 by laventana]
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DavidE
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Posts: 3814
Registered: 12-1-2003
Location: Baja California México
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Mood: 'At home we demand facts and get them. In Mexico one subsists on rumor and never demands anything.' Charles Flandrau,
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Indeed Electricity Is Subsidized
Quote: | Originally posted by laventana
and claim they pay 4000 pesos a month in subsities but does that mean it is true?
Canada delivers electricity to their customers at 7 cents per kwh, usa average is about 11 cents, Hawaii is the most expensive, but they really do
not need AC. The wholesale price of electricity in the USA is about 4-6 cents per kwh. Production cost as someone noted Nuke about 2-4 cents,
coal and natural gas about 4-6 cents. fuel oil cost is about 8-10 cents. solar reflective concentrating 14 cents per kwh I think delivered by the
boulder city plant. Photovoltaic is about 30-40 cents.
WOTTS HOOT. Reading threads that claim electricity is subsidized...
After all, Mexico has to import Mexican oil and process the oil in Mexican refineries at great cost. Refinery workers make twenty dollars an hour,
right? Think of the transportation! Halfway across this narrow country to one of five major refineries!
Then there's transformers! Hauled all the way from Monterrey, Nuevo Leon where they are manufactured for the entire northern Western Hemisphere.
Again, costly due to those twenty dollar an hour wages plus benefits!
PLEASE! Don't forget those punitive corporate taxes!
COPPER! On the far side of the moon. Disregard the fact that Mexico is one of the biggest copper producers and wire manufacturers in the world. Again
poverty stricken unionized workers with profit killing wages and benefits.
Concrete For The Poles. CEMEX is a figure of your imagination.
GLASS INSULATORS. Again, these must be imported from where? Tibet? OK. OK. Monterrey. More union wages.
And those CFE workers. How much? Four times as costly per hour as an SCE. DWP, or PG&E worker.
And the nuclear reactor at Bahia Verde. Do not, I say, do not count the petroleum Mexico traded to France for the reactor. That would not be fair.
Keep this up, I howl until my sides hurt...
COPPER! Yee gads!
Germany has one of the highest rates in the world is 40 cents per kwh retail.
Here in mexico if you hit your DAC rate it is over 4 pesos per kwh plus tax.
I have links to all these numbers if someone wants them. just ask.
I read my meter almost every other day. Have done so for 14 years and it is on a spreadsheet. Do it with water too. I have had some appliances
go bad (salt air is so nasty to electronics) that would have cost me significantly but caught the problem right away, and water line breaks that would
have been expensive, some people hit USD$2,000.00 water bills a month because of a pipe break they did not know about.
Thus this game of saying subsidized, again they could write 4000 pesos and or 1 million, well at those people would figure it out. I bet Carlos is
involved somehow... hahahaha
[Edited on 6-24-2013 by laventana] |
A Lot To See And A Lot To Do
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
    
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
Quote: | Originally posted by durrelllrobert
In Mexicali and other place deemed to be Tierra Caliente they go down for summer months because air condition is necessary (even if you don't have it)
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Sounds like a deal; why are you mad about it? |
Just cause we don't get it in Punta Banda
Bob Durrell
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durrelllrobert
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Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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IF you can remember your user name and password from 8 years ago when you first signed up. If you don't you can't register as a new user.
Bob Durrell
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
    
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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US Water bill
Quote: | Originally posted by laventana
and claim they pay 4000 pesos a month in subsities but does that mean it is true?
Canada delivers electricity to their customers at 7 cents per kwh, usa average is about 11 cents, Hawaii is the most expensive, but they really do
not need AC. The wholesale price of electricity in the USA is about 4-6 cents per kwh. Production cost as someone noted Nuke about 2-4 cents,
coal and natural gas about 4-6 cents. fuel oil cost is about 8-10 cents. solar reflective concentrating 14 cents per kwh I think delivered by the
boulder city plant. Photovoltaic is about 30-40 cents.
Germany has one of the highest rates in the world is 40 cents per kwh retail.
Here in mexico if you hit your DAC rate it is over 4 pesos per kwh plus tax.
I have links to all these numbers if someone wants them. just ask.
I read my meter almost every other day. Have done so for 14 years and it is on a spreadsheet. Do it with water too. I have had some appliances
go bad (salt air is so nasty to electronics) that would have cost me significantly but caught the problem right away, and water line breaks that would
have been expensive, some people hit USD$2,000.00 water bills a month because of a pipe break they did not know about.
Thus this game of saying subsidized, again they could write 4000 pesos and or 1 million, well at those people would figure it out. I bet Carlos is
involved somehow... hahahaha
[Edited on 6-24-2013 by laventana] | At my last house in US my water bill averaged $350/month without any
pipe breaks. What really got me was that for every gallon of water used they added on a sewer usage charge for 100% of those gallons even though I had
a septic system and none of my water went into their sewer.
Bob Durrell
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laventana
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Posts: 216
Registered: 8-24-2006
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lets also look at wiki, from what I read they are accurate on many things, did not see any errors in the basic numbers they showed.
As we know transportation in bulk by ship is very cheap other than pipeline it is the least expensive mode of transportation in the world.
But to prove it lets use a bit of good old fashion common sense. My numbers are spot on.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_Mexico
In 2008 CFE stated they had a loss of 11%. And on our bills they claim they paid at least equal to what they charged to 6 times..... ........ if
they ONLY lost 11% and they were to charge 100% well well... well 11 percent does not equal 100% in my book........
I looked at a recent bill that was 540 pesos and the so called government portion was 1,800 pesos so this is roughly a claimed 300% apportion. So
again if everyone's bill went up 4 times does that equal 11%.....
and as we know hmmm I forgot a few details in the costs, the payoffs, and yet they only were 11% loss. From what I have heard in rumor mills is
the payoff is about 20-30%. And add in the employees of CFE get free electricity. A friend of mine's neighbor works for CFE and their house in the
summer same construction as my friend who uses his AC to just the night and has a $200,00 a month bill. The neighbor same type of house is ice
cycles all day and night.
Here let me give you some shipping numbers. a 40 foot container from China to long beach is about $1,200.00 non peak time. believe it or not that
is very far vs mexico to houston. and the cost of a container per sq foot that is much harder to move around is about 2500 cubic feet one cubic
foot is about 7.5 gallons so to send to china from Los Angeles your fuel t taking into discounts for volume or easier transport, is about 7 cents
per gallon. but return trip doubles it. loading and unloading time have a cost that may be similar, but to unload containers is included in that
price.
distance to china is 7000 miles, so Houston to the Mexican oil fields is how far 500-2000 miles.
this is a decent price approximation for shipping.
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
    
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
Quote: | Originally posted by durrelllrobert
Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
Sounds like a deal; why are you mad about it? |
Just cause we don't get it in Punta Banda |
So is your "excessive" energy consumption there, due to air conditioning? Even in La Paz I've experienced several houses which were livable
completely WITHOUT it, seems like up there in the polar climes of Punta Banda, one should be able to get along with minimal air conditioning...?
What amazes me in La Paz, is how few new houses are constructed with energy consumption in mind. And ironically, those that are constructed "green",
are generally by folks with money, who can afford to pay the energy bills. |
No ac needed in Punta Banda. The highest temp I've seen in the 8 years I've been here was 85 outside and 72 in my house.
The biggest energy consumer is my pila pump which uses 0.75 kWh when it comes on. My problem isn't with the kWh cosumed but with the rate we have to
pay; 3.641 pesos /kWh vs 0.854 in Mexicali
Bob Durrell
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RnR
Senior Nomad
 
Posts: 839
Registered: 5-1-2010
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Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
What amazes me in La Paz, is how few new houses are constructed with energy consumption in mind. And ironically, those that are constructed "green",
are generally by folks with money, who can afford to pay the energy bills. |
A few observations from the La Paz building scene:
1. It costs 10-30% more to build an energy efficient house rather than standard construction.
2. Most homeowners do not spend the summer in the East Cape/La Paz area and, therefore, do not have to worry about paying the AC electric bills
anyway.
3. And, some math on the payback period -
a) Assume a new house costs $100,000 USD.
b) Add a 20% premium for "efficient" construction - $20,000 USD.
c) Guestimate AC electric costs at an additional $100 USD/month for five months - $500/yr.
d) That's a 40 year payback period!
Your average retiree will not live in that house for 40 years to realize the return on the investment. Adjust the numbers as you see fit but it's
tough to make it payback during your average homeowner's occupancy period.
[Edited on 6-25-2013 by RnR]
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DavidE
Ultra Nomad
   
Posts: 3814
Registered: 12-1-2003
Location: Baja California México
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Mood: 'At home we demand facts and get them. In Mexico one subsists on rumor and never demands anything.' Charles Flandrau,
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Actually Laventana, the cost of tankering from Villahermosa to Deer Park is minimal. Far less than the length of the Baja California peninsula, and
then 37% of the refinery output is returned to Queretaro via the El Paso pipeline. The Salina Cruz Oaxaca refinery "feeds" the Rosarito generation
distillation plant # 6 fuel oil. All by tanker. The USA has a far far harder and more expensive time feeding its various refineries. At the Shell Oil
Martinez refinery we fed the PG&E generation plant on site until Shell got tired of it and purchased it to feed LOP (Light Oil Processing).
Do I trust the PRI? About as much as I trust(ed) the USA firms below...
List of major accounting scandals
Company Year Audit Firm Country Notes
Lockheed Corporation 1976[citation needed] United States
Nugan Hand Bank 1980[2] Australia
ZZZZ Best 1986[3] United States Ponzi scheme run by Barry Minkow
Barlow Clowes 1988[4] United Kingdom Gilts management service. £110 million missing
MiniScribe 1989[5] United States
Polly Peck 1990[6] United Kingdom
Bank of Credit and Commerce International 1991[7] United Kingdom
Phar-Mor 1992[8] Coopers & Lybrand United States mail fraud, wire fraud, bank fraud, and transportation of funds obtained by theft or fraud
Informix Corporation 1996[9] Ernst & Young[10] United States
Sybase 1997[11][12][13] Ernst & Young[14] United States
Cendant 1998[15] Ernst & Young United States
Waste Management, Inc. 1999[16] Arthur Andersen United States Financial mistatements
MicroStrategy 2000[17] PricewaterhouseCoopers United States Michael Saylor
Unify Corporation 2000[18] Deloitte & Touche United States
Computer Associates 2000[19] KPMG United States Sanjay Kumar
Lernout & Hauspie 2000[citation needed] KPMG Belgium Fictitious transactions in Korea and improper accounting methodologies elsewhere
Xerox 2000[20] KPMG United States Falsifying financial results
One.Tel 2001[21] Ernst & Young Australia
Enron 2001[22] Arthur Andersen United States Jeffrey Skilling, Kenneth Lay, Andrew Fastow
Swissair 2001 McKinsey & Company Switzerland
Adelphia 2002[23] Deloitte & Touche United States John Rigas
AOL 2002[20] Ernst & Young United States Inflated sales
Bristol-Myers Squibb 2002[20][24] PricewaterhouseCoopers United States Inflated revenues
CMS Energy 2002[20][25] Arthur Andersen United States Round trip trades
Duke Energy 2002[20] Deloitte & Touche United States Round trip trades
Dynegy 2002[20] Arthur Andersen United States Round trip trades
El Paso Corporation 2002[20] Deloitte & Touche United States Round trip trades
Freddie Mac 2002[26] PricewaterhouseCoopers United States Understated earnings
Global Crossing 2002[20] Arthur Andersen Bermuda Network capacity swaps to inflate revenues
Halliburton 2002[20] Arthur Andersen United States Improper booking of cost overruns
Homestore.com 2002[20][27] PricewaterhouseCoopers United States Improper booking of sales
ImClone Systems 2002[28] KPMG United States Samuel D. Waksal
Kmart 2002[20][29] PricewaterhouseCoopers United States Misleading accounting practices
Merck & Co. 2002[20] Pricewaterhouse Coopers United States Recorded co-payments that were not collected
Merrill Lynch 2002[30] Deloitte & Touche United States Conflict of interest
Mirant 2002[20] KPMG United States Overstated assets and liabilities
Nicor 2002[20] Arthur Andersen United States Overstated assets, understated liabilities
Peregrine Systems 2002[20] KPMG United States Overstated sales
Qwest Communications 2002[20] 1999, 2000, 2001 Arthur Andersen 2002 October KPMG United States Inflated revenues
Reliant Energy 2002[20] Deloitte & Touche United States Round trip trades
Sunbeam 2002[31] Arthur Andersen United States
Tyco International 2002[20] PricewaterhouseCoopers Bermuda Improper accounting, Dennis Kozlowski
WorldCom 2002[20] Arthur Andersen United States Overstated cash flows, Bernard Ebbers
Royal Ahold 2003[32] Deloitte & Touche United States Inflating promotional allowances
Parmalat 2003[33][34] Grant Thornton SpA Italy Falsified accounting documents, Calisto Tanzi
HealthSouth Corporation 2003[35] Ernst & Young United States Richard M. Scrushy
Nortel 2003[36] Deloitte & Touche Canada Distributed ill advised corporate bonuses to top 43 managers
Chiquita Brands International 2004[37] Ernst & Young United States Illegal payments
AIG 2004[38] PricewaterhouseCoopers United States Accounting of structured financial deals
Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLC 2008[39] Friehling & Horowitz United States Massive Ponzi scheme.[40]
Anglo Irish Bank 2008[41] Ernst & Young Ireland Anglo Irish Bank hidden loans controversy
Satyam Computer Services 2009[42] PricewaterhouseCoopers India Falsified accounts
Lehman Brothers 2010[43] Ernst & Young United States Failure to disclose Repo 105 transactions to investors
Sino-Forest Corporation 2011[44] Ernst & Young Canada-China
Olympus Corporation 2011[45] Ernst & Young Japan tobashi using acquisitions
Autonomy Corporation 2012[46] Deloitte & Touche United States Subsidiary of HP.
Waddles, Quacks and has lots and lots of feathers, than 11%
A Lot To See And A Lot To Do
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laventana
Nomad

Posts: 216
Registered: 8-24-2006
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Mood: sharing
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Quote: | Originally posted by RnR
Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
What amazes me in La Paz, is how few new houses are constructed with energy consumption in mind. And ironically, those that are constructed "green",
are generally by folks with money, who can afford to pay the energy bills. |
A few observations from the La Paz building scene:
1. It costs 10-30% more to build an energy efficient house rather than standard construction.
2. Most homeowners do not spend the summer in the East Cape/La Paz area and, therefore, do not have to worry about paying the AC electric bills
anyway.
3. And, some math on the payback period -
a) Assume a new house costs $100,000 USD.
b) Add a 20% premium for "efficient" construction - $20,000 USD.
c) Guestimate AC electric costs at an additional $100 USD/month for five months - $500/yr.
d) That's a 40 year payback period!
Your average retiree will not live in that house for 40 years to realize the return on the investment. Adjust the numbers as you see fit but it's
tough to make it payback during your average homeowner's occupancy period.
[Edited on 6-25-2013 by RnR] | not sure if you are hitting the numbers exactly. I would estimate it being
about 10% to make a huge difference.
a friend of mine opened a foam block manufacturing plant in LaPaz about a year ago. so he takes the foam from packing materials and processes them
into blocks with a R factor of about 23. Most construction already insulates the roof from what I have seen here. So his material is just
affecting the outside walls not the cost of anything else. That type of block has been used in the USA for about 20 years plus.
His site estimated the add-on cost to a house is about $4,000.00 for every 1000 square feet. so lets say his numbers are correct.
I have a friend who has a 2000 sq foot living space solid typical block home that he built not expecting to live down here. Due to financial
scircumstances now lives here full time. He has hit the DAC rate and is now paying about 4 pesos plus tax per Kwh. He has a bill last summer for
18,000 pesos. So with tax about USD$900.00 a month. They zone cool. Note because they are on the DAC rate it is 12 months before you are
removed and they will not be removed because they continue to use a lot of electricity, so it quadruples their every month bill. So they are
paying an extra $200.00-$300.00 a month for the other months too.
I have one stand alone bedroom in direct sunlight that is R12 walls and R30 roof and I use a 7000 BTU AC split unit and when I run it at night you
wake up freezing if you want for about 7 kwh usage per night. Or 210 kwhs per month or about $20.00 a month. I also have low cost US double pane e
glass, with UV and infrared reflecting glass from Lowes in the USA that cost about one third the price of windows down here.
So lets assume the same savings with this other block which is double the insulating factor. This would give them using the zone cooling about
1000 kwh to be in comfort. With a bill of about $200.00 a month. So he would save about $700.00 a month for 4-5 months.
This means he would pay off his $8,000.00-$12,000.00 for 2000 sq feet increase in cost to build in 3-5 years. And should he ever sell that would
be a huge selling feature vs a house that does not have it..
My friends website for the environmentally friendly block is www.efblockmx.info
Not to mention being warmer in the winter. It does get cold down here for a few weeks sometimes. And non insulated block retains that cold. I
have some friends who heat their concrete block homes with their ovens in the winter to take that morning bite off. I warn them about the carbon
monoxide issue.
www.efblockmx.info
[Edited on 6-25-2013 by laventana]
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DavidE
Ultra Nomad
   
Posts: 3814
Registered: 12-1-2003
Location: Baja California México
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Mood: 'At home we demand facts and get them. In Mexico one subsists on rumor and never demands anything.' Charles Flandrau,
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I tried "taking the chill off" a tiny 2X6 plywood house last winter with LPG. Sixty dollars, three weeks and four degrees warmer I figured THAT was a
loser.
A Lot To See And A Lot To Do
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willardguy
Elite Nomad
    
Posts: 6451
Registered: 9-19-2009
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Quote: | Originally posted by durrelllrobert
Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
Quote: | Originally posted by durrelllrobert
Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
Sounds like a deal; why are you mad about it? |
Just cause we don't get it in Punta Banda |
So is your "excessive" energy consumption there, due to air conditioning? Even in La Paz I've experienced several houses which were livable
completely WITHOUT it, seems like up there in the polar climes of Punta Banda, one should be able to get along with minimal air conditioning...?
What amazes me in La Paz, is how few new houses are constructed with energy consumption in mind. And ironically, those that are constructed "green",
are generally by folks with money, who can afford to pay the energy bills. |
No ac needed in Punta Banda. The highest temp I've seen in the 8 years I've been here was 85 outside and 72 in my house.
The biggest energy consumer is my pila pump which uses 0.75 kWh when it comes on. My problem isn't with the kWh cosumed but with the rate we have to
pay; 3.641 pesos /kWh vs 0.854 in Mexicali | alright im lost. I get the 3 tier pricing. so do you fall into
the basico,intermedio, or excedente pricing level?
and I get different area pricing but how can you be paying 3.641 pesos/kwh when just up the road here in rosarito im paying 0.750 ???? is this really
THAT unfair?
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laventana
Nomad

Posts: 216
Registered: 8-24-2006
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Mood: sharing
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Quote: | Originally posted by willardguy
alright im lost. I get the 3 tier pricing. so do you fall into the basico,intermedio, or excedente pricing level?
and I get different area pricing but how can you be paying 3.641 pesos/kwh when just up the road here in rosarito im paying 0.750 ???? is this really
THAT unfair? |
there is also a DAC rate. Once you hit it you have a minimum of 12 months before you can be removed. it is for every kwh around 4 pesos plus per
kwh and no tiers.
Hint some people get around it by "renting" out their place and changing the name on the bill which resets the rate to begin over.
[Edited on 6-25-2013 by laventana]
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