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ramuma53
Banned
Posts: 793
Registered: 2-27-2003
Location: Mulege B.C.S. Mexico
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Bajaeng
That suposed to be the Reforma Agraria Secretary (SRA), but they are a very ineficient and corrupt bunch, that try to charge you for every thing you
try to do and their job, is to make everything more difficult to be able to charge more.
Also, the Public Notary, the Cadastral officer and the Public Registry are in charge to watch that their files are equal and the same as the federal
registries, but they have a tradition to ignore this obligation in Baja.
As you say, that attitude must generate a lot of problems and you are right, Baja is one of the places in Mexico where the land problems are choking
the tribunals; what they are doing, is choking every one of them but not even that way, they understand and that happen, because the strongest is
getting all and devouring the samllest developers.
A problem cannot exist if the people that are in charge do their job with efficiency, but in this case, those people are not doing their job according
to the law and should not be trusted with your money.
As you see, people come here to insult the massager, but not to give arguments against what I say and that is because there are no legal arguments.
I have been warning the Estate Government, the city government and the developers for 20 years, but since those entities are composed of the people
with money, they are more interested in protecting their buddies wallets, than to correct a very old and unpopular problem, a problem that will cost
them a bunch of dollars, but they are getting form the American buyer, a lot bigger bunch of dollars, or at least they were getting it.
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Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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Ramuma53: I am curious about something. You have been fighting this fight for 20 years. It would seem that your efforts are gaining momentum. Do
you think the internet has made this possible? Do you think YouTube has made Mexico change much more rapidly than it would have liked to? A recent
poll said 20% of all Mexico households have high speed internet access.
[Edited on 4-15-2011 by Woooosh]
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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ramuma53
Banned
Posts: 793
Registered: 2-27-2003
Location: Mulege B.C.S. Mexico
Member Is Offline
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Wooosh
Sincerely, this is a last resort measure and I am doing it, because advising the Estate Government only made some of them very rich, advising the
public officials, only made then try to land me in jail, advising the Real Estate Agents, only made them hate me and advising the Developers, made the
few that were immediately benefited, appreciate my efforts, but most of them, only hated me for trying to help them, they absolutely do not want any
help that may cost them money or contradict the land buys they have made through very doubtful ways; this because most of them, just appropriated the
land by time limitation (Prescripciones) or just plainly stole the land from old occupants by using their political muscle.
Do you know that to be a called a leader is a crime in Baja California? In any other part of the world, it is a compliment and you are honored when
they call you that, not in Baja, they land you in jail and that is because they like the status quo, never move or inform the people because then you
are a criminal for them.
Of course Internet help on this issue and in any other, because it is difficult for them to stop the information, just see how ferocious were the
Jesse attacks or the other new lady, but at the end, many people recognize that they were not providing sound advice and they were not able to just
shut me up or steal the newspaper copies like they used to do to ABC or the Gringo Gazette.
Nancy, the Gringo Gazette reporter, was the only American reporter that listened to my arguments and took the time to investigate and corroborate my
information and that is why, she started to write about the land problem, but as soon as the then Rosarito major Hugo Torres Chavert, leaned of it, he
ordered the Gringo Gazette to be taken away from stores as soon as it was provided to them.
She was forced out of Rosarito by stealing her newspapers and by attacking her in criminal court so many times that she was not able to justify it to
her bosses and they just abandoned Rosarito; some people laugh about this, but I think it is shameful for the Rosarito´s people.
At one time, I tried it with the San Diego Union reporter and she received the whole information, interviewed many Americans, who knew about the
problem and at the end, she did not print a letter about that, when she told us, she was going to print our story, she printed the Ejido Chef saying
that in Rosarito everything was fine and never called us back and later, started to attack us, clearly she was convinced by the dark side$$$$$$$.
To do this now is impossible, to jail me for doing it would be an international scandal and they just cannot deny the arguments and the information
finally is reaching the people who affect directly, they are not being able to shut it up, thanks to the fact that Mexico is not China.
This will be here and will reach the people who need it or at least I hope so, because as some of them told me by email that Gringos remember only a
couple of years and then it will be business like usual.
It is up to people in this forum to let that happen or not.
Some of you are questioning my motives by email?
I am doing this because I own land in the Tijuana Rosarito strip and I was spending more time in courts than developing my properties, I was forced to
investigate the place history up to the last details to protect my properties and even after that, I cannot develop them because developers do not
want to buy land, they want to steal it or nothing.
Once I was convinced that to protect my land, it was necessary to buy it to the Federal Government, I did it against all the developers opinion; most
of them thought that if this information became public, they will have to pay for all the land they had and most of them had a lot, obtained by
frankly fraudulent ways and at that time I started to split myself from them.
I predicted the Real Estate crisis in 1992, I predicted that Rosarito would follow Ensenada and everybody told me I was crazy, that it would never
happen in Rosarito because at that time, you were not able to walk on the streets because of the amount of American visitors, but Ensenada was a clear
warning that if you take advantage of your customer, they will just go to other places.
At this time, I want to clean Rosarito before I can invest or develop my Rosarito properties, I refuse to just fallow those 200 developers that built
without the minimal land legality, just hoping to sell before everything exploded.
I tried all the normal ways and I started to escalate until there were no more people in higher places, who listened about the problem and its
consequences and as in any business, then, the only option, was the boss, the only guy on top of the business and government directors, the customer,
because he is the only one, who can force all those money and political guys, to recognize that they have a problem, that is no longer concealable and
they have finally to correct it, because in this case, time will not correct it as they hoped and to dump it on the customer is no longer acceptable
or hided.
[Edited on 4-15-2011 by ramuma53]
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Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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Ramuma53- Well, I think for maximum effect your next step is to produce a simple YouTube video series of your information. People will watch YouTube
and they believe what they can see with their own eyes. Charts and Maps scan easily into a video too. Mexican gov't workers have access to YouTube on
their desks because that's what they use for training and communication videos. The YouTube video series and information will forever be there on the
web for anyone who wants to see it in the future.
BTW- Regarding our concession: A PGR investigator came to the house yesterday to investigate the denuncia we filed against the squatter. He said
they were also contacted by SEMARNAT on this specific concession issue. He spent half an hour walking around the area before he came up to the house.
He asked how much we paid for it per year (11,000 pesos) and why we wanted to protect it (as a free beach for the people of Rosarito). He said he
would open a file and we would be called into the office to show our title papers. (maybe the video had some impact?)
[Edited on 4-15-2011 by Woooosh]
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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ramuma53
Banned
Posts: 793
Registered: 2-27-2003
Location: Mulege B.C.S. Mexico
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Wooosh
you are right about YOuTube, I will start working on it
Concerning your concession, your legal answer to that question should be - Hornato it means that you want that area just to keep it as a good view for
your pleasure and it can not be concessioned to any other person for other purposes, like a restaurant or something.
I will leave the tools here also, I will start to put up the key documents on this story in a way that people can use it to uphold their questions and
requesto to developers with a documental base, something that can not be denied or say it is a theory.
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Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
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Mood: undecided
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I'm getting the idea that a Gringo buying property down in Baja/Mexico from another Gringo or a Mexican or anybody else for that matter, might as well
be rolling the dice. And the dice aren't normal dice, they've got to be read by a whole crew of lawyers, local mucky mucks and anybody else that comes
down the pike. I'll pass.
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jenny.navarrette
Banned
Posts: 275
Registered: 3-3-2011
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Can't Tell Your Players Without a Scorecard
OK, here is the score so far in this Chinese Fire Drill:
1. Hugo Torres Chabert. Mr. Hugo Torres Chabert is the developer of La Jolla del Mar. This condominium development is owned by three
investors, including Hugo Torres. Torres is also the owner of the Rosarito Beach Hotel, the Oceana towers development, the local Rosarito newspaper
Ecos de Rosarito, and the Baja Tourist Guide. He is a two-time former Mayor of Playas de Rosarito.
2. The Corona Family. The Coronas are an old Rosarito family that own the Hotel Corona, Castillos del Mar, and many other properties
in Rosarito. They claim to be the real owners of the La Jolla del Mar property. The Coronas and the Torres have been in litigation over the La Jolla
del Mar for more than 20 years. If the Coronas win their lawsuits, title to the La Jolla del Mar property could revert to them.
3. Mr. Rafael Muñoz MartinezMr. Rafael Mr. Rafael Muñoz is the director of The BiNational Commission of Coastal
Residents. This group is an advocacy coalition that has been involved in many past property disputes, including those in Popotla, El Capito,
Venustiano Carranza, the artisan's market, Castillo del Mar, and Punta Banda. In some of these other disputes, they have opposed actions taken by Mr.
Hugo Torres. Rafael Muñoz is a former newspaper publisher and also was a candidate for the Baja State Senate in 2000. Mr. Munoz's mother sold the land
underlying the La Jolla del Mar condominiums to the Coronas, a fact that Mr. Muñoz has failed to state in his over 425 posts on BajaNomads. Nor has
Mr. Muñoz ever mentioned how his mother came to have title to the property in the first place and has not stated whether her chaim of title has the
vitally important National Land deed at the bottom. We will just have to wait for that.
4. Ejido Mazatlan. An ejido is a group of communal landowners that enjoy special land rights and legal protections under Mexican law.
The Ejido Mazatlan owns huge tracts of land in and around the Rosarito area. Both the Ejido and Mr. Hugo Torres claim that the La Jolla del Mar
property was originally ejido land.
5. Fernando Gomez Chavez. Mr. Gomez Chavez obtained the La Jolla del Mar property indirectly from Ejido Mazatlan, and re-sold the
property to Hugo Torres. The validity of Mr. Gomez's title is a major issue in the lawsuits. Mr. Gomez worked as lawyer for The BiNational Commission
of Coastal Residents -- directed by Rafael Muñoz Martinez -- and represented the Corona family in a related lawsuit on the Castillos del Mar property
against Ejido Mazatlan, which also claimed ownership of the Castillo del Mar property. For some strange reason, in all his 425 posts on BajaNomads,
Mr. Muñoz omitted saying that Mr. Gomez Chavez was his former employee. Mr. Muñoz claimed that Mr. Gomez Chavez turned traitor and cut a deal with
Ejido Mazatlan to purposefully lose the lawsuit for his clients, the Coronas. The duplicity was discovered and Mr. Muñoz fired Mr. Gomez Chavez and
the Coronas won the lawsuit. The Mexican Supreme Court ruled that the Ejido's version of the survey map showing the boundaries of the Ejido property
was null and void and therefore the Ejido had no claim to the Castillo del Mar property. The Ejido's claim to ownership of the La Jolla del Mar
parcel is also based on that same map, which the Supreme Court has already denied. In spite of the fact that the Corona's won the lawsuit, Mr. Gomez
Chavez somehow acquired the La Jolla del Mar property from Ejido Mazatlan anyway and resold it to Hugo Torres.
As far as I can see, nobody owns legitmately any of these properties. It's just a bunch of landgrubbers fighting each other over it.
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ramuma53
Banned
Posts: 793
Registered: 2-27-2003
Location: Mulege B.C.S. Mexico
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Cypress
As I told you, buying property is not an easy thing here or any place in the world; more because in the USA or Australia or England, the Public
Registry show and is a proof of property, while in Mexico, it is only an informative tool; to have an inscription there does not mean you have full or
doubtless property.
Also I am telling you, that if you approach buying property like you do in the USA, just trusting other people to do your investigation, you will have
problems.
That you can buy in Baja, but you have to be careful and rootles, do not confide in the sellers, just ask for the whole title chain up to the first
document and it should be a National Land title issued after 1950 in the Rosarito Area and after 1917 every other place in Baja.
That you can buy real Estate at reduced prices and fix the problem you know exist and make a bundle of money.
Of course, this is not for the people that want easy things or just turn key houses; if you want that, just pass over Rosarito or look for the very
few places that already have fixed the problem.
If you buy on El Morro area, you will never have a problem, they have National Land titles since the 1950 and they will gladly show it to you, only
people who are trying to hide something and make a< fool out of you, get insulted by the buyer when he ask for what he should have but do not have.
Remember that the crook always get insulted when you doubt or test his honesty; honest people even get glad that you ask for what he already has. Only
crooks tell you that their reputation is beyond doubt and offer you in house title insurance.
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ramuma53
Banned
Posts: 793
Registered: 2-27-2003
Location: Mulege B.C.S. Mexico
Member Is Offline
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jenny.navarrette
Of course you can tell Your Players Without a Scorecard, but, you have to say the true facts.
OK, here is the score so far in this Chinese Fire Drill:
1. HUGO TORRES CHABERT. MR. HUGO TORRES CHABERT IS THE DEVELOPER OF LA JOLLA DEL MAR. THIS CONDOMINIUM DEVELOPMENT IS OWNED BY THREE INVESTORS,
INCLUDING HUGO TORRES. TORRES IS ALSO THE OWNER OF THE ROSARITO BEACH HOTEL, THE OCEANA TOWERS DEVELOPMENT, THE LOCAL ROSARITO NEWSPAPER ECOS DE
ROSARITO, AND THE BAJA TOURIST GUIDE. HE IS A TWO-TIME FORMER MAYOR OF PLAYAS DE ROSARITO.
Hugo Torres Chavert, you accept built and is actually selling La Joya del Mar, ¨you say¨, he owns Hotel Rosarito, Oceana and was 2 times Rosarito
major, but:
How come, you accept that he is in litigation, with the Coronas over La Joya del Mar, while at the same time, he is selling La Joya del Mar, without
disclosing that capital fact, to American buyers??????? And giving In House title insurance on it??????? That is not an honest thing to do!!!!!
Why are you, not denouncing the fraud also????
Is he telling his buyers that he is in litigation? And, that he may very well have to return the property to the Coronas in the near
future??????????????????
Is this very important fact, being fully disclosed to his buyers when they buy at La Joya del Mar???? as it should be in any Real Estate
sale???????????????.
If not, you must accept, he is a crook, trying and actually commiting fraud against the American Real Estate buyer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
For the same reason I have proved here, he absolutely does not OWN the Rosarito hotel, he is holding the concession of it, for the waiter and bar
tender union only, only a concession, because it is National Property, that has never been sold by the Nation, in other words, it is National Property
only a concession granted to the union, he is just a big fraud.
He has never been 2 times major, he has been elected only once, the first time he was named by the PAN Estate government, to head the counsel, holding
it until elections were held and when he was elected major, the crime soared to heights that has never been observed in Rosarito, pollution was hided
and newspapers stolen to hide the true from the Rosarito people, he is nothing to be proud of, instead he is a shame to Rosarito, because a honest
people will never sell a property that is in jeopardy by lawsuits, while not disclosing that to the American buyers.
Oceana is built also over National Land, named Rancho Costa Azul, that belong to a third person and litigations are also on the going, while I have
never heard, that a buyer on those developments, had those fact disclosed to them!!!.
2. THE CORONA FAMILY. THE CORONAS ARE AN OLD ROSARITO FAMILY THAT OWN THE HOTEL CORONA, CASTILLOS DEL MAR, AND MANY OTHER PROPERTIES IN ROSARITO. THEY
CLAIM TO BE THE REAL OWNERS OF THE LA JOLLA DEL MAR PROPERTY. THE CORONAS AND THE TORRES HAVE BEEN IN LITIGATION OVER THE LA JOLLA DEL MAR FOR MORE
THAN 20 YEARS. IF THE CORONAS WIN THEIR LAWSUITS, TITLE TO THE LA JOLLA DEL MAR PROPERTY COULD REVERT TO THEM.
Sorry but the Coronas are not an old Rosairto Family, they an old Tijuana and Ensenada family, but new to Rosarito.
They do not claim to own La Joya del Mar, they were claiming to own Playa Encantada, the place that Hugo Torres and partners through Fraud and buying
the Playa Encantada attorneys, managed to get possession from Tomas Corona and the real owner, but later, Tomas Corona Recognized that Playa Encantada
is National land, owned by another person that is in litigation in Mexico city to get back that land form La Joya del Mar.
Playa Encantada was national Land until 1992, when it was sold by the nation to the actual owner, who bought it, grounding her possession, on a right
to buy National Land, that my mother legally received in 1952, advising the one receiving the right, that it was National Land and giving her, the
right to possess National Land, legally and formally issued to her in 1952 by the Agrarian Department, now the SRA, on proof that she was possessing
it, since 1949, because on good faith, she publicly bought it from Rosa Machado, in other words, a perfectly legal way to buy and prove possession.
Then, since Tomas Corona, who own Castillos del Mar next door to Playa Encantada, own it because they bought it from the National Land office on my
advice, claimed also Playa Encantada to the National Land office, then, he was advised by the SRA, that Playa Encantada was already claimed before and
with more force, by the actual owner; learning that, he in an honest gesture, recognized the actual owner right to Own Playa Encantada and is with
this person, with whom La Joya del Mar, is in litigation, not with the Coronas, but that does not change the fact, that Hugo Torres Chavert, is acting
with dishonesty and falsehood, toward the American buyer, when he does not fully disclose those legal problems, that he will certainly lose in the
near future, subjecting the American buyer to another Punta Banda.
3. MR. RAFAEL MUÑOZ MARTINEZ MR. RAFAEL MR. RAFAEL MUÑOZ IS THE DIRECTOR OF THE BINATIONAL COMMISSION OF COASTAL RESIDENTS. THIS GROUP IS AN ADVOCACY
COALITION THAT HAS BEEN INVOLVED IN MANY PAST PROPERTY DISPUTES, INCLUDING THOSE IN POPOTLA, EL CAPITO, VENUSTIANO CARRANZA, THE ARTISAN'S MARKET,
CASTILLO DEL MAR, AND PUNTA BANDA. IN SOME OF THESE OTHER DISPUTES, THEY HAVE OPPOSED ACTIONS TAKEN BY MR. HUGO TORRES. RAFAEL MUÑOZ IS A FORMER
NEWSPAPER PUBLISHER AND ALSO WAS A CANDIDATE FOR THE BAJA STATE SENATE IN 2000. MR. MUNOZ'S MOTHER SOLD THE LAND UNDERLYING THE LA JOLLA DEL MAR
CONDOMINIUMS TO THE CORONAS, A FACT THAT MR. MUÑOZ HAS FAILED TO STATE IN HIS OVER 425 POSTS ON BAJANOMADS. NOR HAS MR. MUÑOZ EVER MENTIONED HOW HIS
MOTHER CAME TO HAVE TITLE TO THE PROPERTY IN THE FIRST PLACE AND HAS NOT STATED WHETHER HER CHAIM OF TITLE HAS THE VITALLY IMPORTANT NATIONAL LAND
DEED AT THE BOTTOM. WE WILL JUST HAVE TO WAIT FOR THAT.
The BiNational Commission of Coastal Residents was created by me and others in 1992 to help al the small land owners, American and Mexican alike, with
the procedure to legalize their land, through the National Land office, bringing them in to full land ownership legality, then they elected me the
first president, yes, we gave all this information to all the social groups and that was the fact, that the big land owners and developers didn´t like
and the one who were heading the big land owners and developers, was and is no other than Hugo Torres Chavert and Ismael Yagues Ames
(Lagsa).
Yes, and I would do it again, We protected the Venustiano Carranza from the developers who were trying to steal their possessed land since 1940,
Protected the Fisherman from Hugo Torres Chavert and his cousin and helped Casillos del Mar against Ejido Mazatlan, El Oasis, El Morro, El Campito,
the Rosarito Beach Merchants, the Horse Renters Association from Hugo Torres Chavert, Mercado Benito Juarez from Hugo Torres Chavert, Playa Encantada
from Hugo Torres Chavert and Ejido Mazatlan and several Rosarito colonies that were being defrauded by Ejido Mazatlan with the help of the then major
Hugo Torres Chavert.
We managed to obtain for our members, a lot of National Land titles and procedures, at a very low price and those are the only Private property titles
in the coastal strip, beside the El Morro titles that were issued in 1950, but Hugo Torres Chavert with the big land owners and developers influence,
managed to close without a legal reason the SRA federal office, that was issuing the titles, to every person that asked for them and proved real
possession.
Concerning my mother, Sorry, but my mother gave away the possession rights she bought in 1949 to another person, who is also recognized by Tomas
Corona as Playa Encantada legal owner.
To clear what you ask, my mother Juana Martinez de Muñoz and my aunt Mercedes Martinez de Velilla, who at that, time was District Federal Judge, they
bought Playa Encantada in 1949 from Rosa Machado, who claimed was one of the inheritants to Joaquin Machado Valdes and later in 1952 learned that the
sale was a fraud, because the national Land office, in 1952 gave them notice that the land was actually national Land.
Mercedes Martinez de Velilla, my aunt, then Federal Judge, was the first woman graduated from the Jalisco University and the one who initiated most of
the Mexican woman attorneys professional bars associations, was also known as the Iron Judge because together with the Iron District Attorney
the legendary Mr. Tocacangas, closed all the casinos in Baja, on the Mexico´s president orders, one of them, the one illegally operated by Hugo Torres
Chavert and his aunt.
Both of those very active ladies, had as their good father, the then Mexico´s president Lazaro Card##as del Rio, while one of my uncles, was the
president´s personal doctor.
Both of those ladies, were helped on building Playa Encantada by my cousin, Aida Baltazar Martinez, that in 1965 became Tijuana councilwoman and one
of the most respected popular leaders in Tijuana, who founded several of the biggest colonies, like Obrera Primero de Mayo or Postal and many others
and her daughter, Mercedes Herdman Baltazar, has became 2 times Tijuana councilwoman, Estate congresswoman and later Federal congresswoman for Baja
California and at this time, she has a high post in new PRI Tijuana Administration.
I tell you this to show that, we are an old local family, that are dedicated do build Tijuana and Rosarito on the long run, not to commit fraud
against the American buyer.
4. EJIDO MAZATLAN. AN EJIDO IS A GROUP OF COMMUNAL LANDOWNERS THAT ENJOY SPECIAL LAND RIGHTS AND LEGAL PROTECTIONS UNDER MEXICAN LAW. THE EJIDO
MAZATLAN OWNS HUGE TRACTS OF LAND IN AND AROUND THE ROSARITO AREA. BOTH THE EJIDO AND MR. HUGO TORRES CLAIM THAT THE LA JOLLA DEL MAR PROPERTY WAS
ORIGINALLY EJIDO LAND.
Hugo Torres Chavert claim it was Ejido, but he being Rosarito major, know, that the parcel 58 B, that they claim is on top of Playa Encantada,
was expropriated and paid to them in full, to the Ejido in 1986 and is located on the East side of the old road, not to the west and that fact, prove
that he commited fraud against Playa Encantada, helped by the Ejido Mazatlan and Fernando Gomez Chavez.
In 1937 the Mexico´s president expropriated land to the Machado Family ??? in an error, the never made the legal steps to give them any physical land;
they got what is known as Virtual execution of a Presidential decree that the Supreme Court has found illegal and nonexistent ad as a consequence,
Ejido Mazatlan own some land taken from the Machado Family that nobody know where it is and that they have never received in a legal way; also all
their topoghraphical plans are a joke made at the order, with absolutely no technical grounds and as a consequence, they absolutely cannot prove where
Ejido Mazatlan is in nature, fact that allowed us to win Castillos del Mar, El Oasis, and soon Playa Encantada.
5. Fernando Gomez Chavez. Mr. Gomez Chavez obtained the La Jolla del Mar property indirectly from Ejido Mazatlan, and re-sold the property to Hugo
Torres. The validity of Mr. Gomez's title is a major issue in the lawsuits. Mr. Gomez worked as lawyer for The BiNational Commission of Coastal
Residents -- directed by Rafael Muñoz Martinez -- and represented the Corona family in a related lawsuit on the Castillos del Mar property against
Ejido Mazatlan, which also claimed ownership of the Castillo del Mar property. For some strange reason, in all his 425 posts on BajaNomads, Mr. Muñoz
omitted saying that Mr. Gomez Chavez was his former employee. Mr. Muñoz claimed that Mr. Gomez Chavez turned traitor and cut a deal with Ejido
Mazatlan to purposefully lose the lawsuit for his clients, the Coronas. The duplicity was discovered and Mr. Muñoz fired Mr. Gomez Chavez and the
Coronas won the lawsuit. The Mexican Supreme Court ruled that the Ejido's version of the survey map showing the boundaries of the Ejido property was
null and void and therefore the Ejido had no claim to the Castillo del Mar property. The Ejido's claim to ownership of the La Jolla del Mar parcel is
also based on that same map, which the Supreme Court has already denied. In spite of the fact that the Corona's won the lawsuit, Mr. Gomez Chavez
somehow acquired the La Jolla del Mar property from Ejido Mazatlan anyway and resold it to Hugo Torres.
Fernando Gomez Chavez (sorry but I cannot call him neither Mr. or attorney) in 1992, Fernando Gomez Chavez was the Public Defender in Rosarito, almost
dying of starvation; he owned no land or any kind of property in Rosarito, he was just arriving from Guadalajara Jalisco where the mafia was looking
for him and for what I know they are still waiting for him. In other words a pennyless guy in 1992. Take note
Then, another attorney, friend of mine, referred him to me, to fill the The BiNational Commission of Coastal Residents attorney post, I talked to him
and found him a very brilliant guy, we hired him and he started to fight all the legal battles against Ejido Mazatlan, Hugo Torres Chavert and the big
landowners with the Machados behind, he won the Castillos Del Mar trial on National Land grounds and by demonstrating that Ejido Mazatlan is a
fraud but very important for the near future, he demostrated that Parcel 58 B is on the East side of the highway, not over Castillos del Mar or Playa
Encantada.
He, with my information and direction, won the Benito Juarez market against Hugo Torres Chavert and several others, but then Hugo Torres Chavert
started to call him and invite him to make a deal with the Mazatlan Ejido, he proposed that to us and all the The BiNational Commission of Coastal
Residents´s meeting, denied the deal, but he just went alone and sold himself to Hugo Torres Chavert and the Ejido Mazatlan, turning coats on the
Corona Family and Playa Encantada, he just sold those cases, but the corona Family acting fast, got another attorney and corrected what he was
selling, but not Playa Encantada, where he suddenly appeared as an old ejidatario, owning for decades the false parcel that supposedly affect Playa
Encantada and he in a cynic legal charade, gave the land to the Ejido, then received the same land as payment and then sold it to Hugo Torres Chavert
and La Joya del Mar for only USD$500,000.00 plus a condo.
It is easy to prove the Fernando Gomez Chavez and Hugo Torres Chavert connection, because as part of his traitor deal, he received a condominium on
one of the Hugo Torres Chavert towers, where at this day, he is living with his cousin-wife, in other words, he is still living on Hugo Torres Chavert
supposed property, because that is the kind of people, Torres Chaver love in more than one way.
The only problem is, that Playa Encantada, is at this day, National land already sold, to the actual owner and since time limitations do not affect
National land, the problem is still on the going and I predict on legal grounds, that in the near future, Federal criminal charges will be filled
against Fernando Gomez Chavez and the return of La Joya del Mar, to the real Playa Encantada owners, while La Joya del Mar, will disappear and the in
house title insurance, will have to be delivered to the actual American buyers and it is up to them and the nation, to fill criminal charges against
them for fraud.
AS FAR AS I CAN SEE, NOBODY OWNS LEGITIMATELY ANY OF THESE PROPERTIES. IT'S JUST A BUNCH OF LAND GRUBBERS FIGHTING EACH OTHER OVER IT.
On this your last statement, I agree with you, The Nation own them, the only people who escape from this mess, is the people who bought legally from
the national Land office, like Castillos del Mar, Venustiano Carranza, El Oasis, El Morro and Playa Encantada (not La Joya del Mar or La Puerta del
Mar).
As you see, this is a legal problem in the going and American buyers should know, what they are buying in to, I ABSOLUTELY DEPLORE, what La Puerta del
Mar, La Joya del Mar, LAGSA, Hugo Torres Chavert and the supposed Machado-Crostwhite are doing, by misleading the American buyer in to buying
illegally acquired properties, that are subjected to legal problems, that will surely affect them in the form, of losing their bought houses, bought
with hard earned money, along their lives and through what, I can call, a Fraud against the buyer, the Nation and the original possessors.
Also Jenny.navarrete if you know all those facts, how come you are not disclosing them to the American buyer and denouncin publicly the gigant fraud
you know about.??????
If you do it, you will find that you are not alone.
[Edited on 4-17-2011 by ramuma53]
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wessongroup
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Some great information, and a good bottom line question
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ramuma53
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Wesogroup
It looks like a lot of people, know about this heavy problem, but choose just to be in bed with the developers, getting the easy money from the
American buyer and trying to hide what they should be telling to every prospected buyer.
Jenny.navarrete is a newcomer Nomad, and she is certainly a Real Estate agent based in Rosarito and that mean, that every Real Estate Agent in
Rosarito, know the problems in detail, but just want to hide the problem, so they can keep on selling to unsuspected American buyers.
We need to create a honesty conscience among the Real Estate Agents, so they start protecting the buyer all the way, even if that mean low sales to
start, but they have to create a honesty base, that regain the buyer confidence.
If they do not start doing that soon, they will end like the Ensenada Real Estate agents, selling for pennies what they used to sell for dollars.
[Edited on 4-18-2011 by ramuma53]
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Woooosh
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ramuma53
Wesogroup
It looks like a lot of people, know about this heavy problem, but choose just to be in bed with the developers, getting the easy money from the
American buyer and trying to hide what they should be telling to every prospected buyer.
Jenny.navarrete is a newcomer Nomad, and she is certainly a Real Estate agent based in Rosarito and that mean, that every Real Estate Agent in
Rosarito, know the problems in detail, but just want to hide the problem, so they can keep on selling to unsuspected American buyers.
We need to create a honesty conscience among the Real Estate Agents, so they start protecting the buyer all the way, even if that mean low sales to
start, but they have to create a honesty base, that regain the buyer confidence.
If they do not start doing that soon, they will end like the Ensenada Real Estate agents, selling for pennies what they used to sell for dollars.
[Edited on 4-18-2011 by ramuma53] |
100% correct and this thread is the beginning of the public discussion to bring awareness and hopefully the change. The buying has stopped and won't
start in Rosarito again until people feel safe in their investments. People will build, but few will buy.
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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wessongroup
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Would say this thread is doing more good than bad...
Excellent information on: history, essential check points for doing one's own due diligence and the relevant Agency's which "hold" the proper
documentation and the means to obtain same..
Thanks for all the help .... I believe there are at least three or four who have already benifited from this thread .... which is really a happy
ending ... and I really like happy endings....
Find it really great for someone to share all this information on this subject for way less than 6%
Thanks again... my notes continue to grow, as does my knowledge... 
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rgbajabob
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This guy Ramuma53, aka rafael munoz is so full of it his eyes are brown!! Stop listening to him...as you can tell he loves to have an audience....has
anyone actualy checked out his "facts" I doubt it. have any of you met him? I doubt it as well...Why not ask the americans whose homes he has
confiscated with dubious paperwork??? They exist, he even listed them on the turtle bust thread. He is just a salesman for himself and loves any
chance to discredit Torres, who he was suing ( and lost!) again...This is all a stage for him to bring attention to his attempts to win his court
cases....here in rosarito and in Mulege where he is still being sued although he denies it (check the turlte thread)
He just quotes "facts---his facts" and expects you to believe him...he never presents solid evidence just spouts off verbage and it seems some of you
buy it and actually thank him...amazing......It's like taking cooking lessons from Hannibal Lector.....You are just encouraging him to build his soap
box higher and higher! Funny, among all the lawyers and legal experts he is the only one to have this information.....it is all a big plot and he is
the only one with the answers....doesn't this seem strange to any of you?? I know, he only wants to help everyone.....ssshhhsssh!
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krafty
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And how do you know this, rgbajabob? Just curious.
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ELINVESTIG8R
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How about some proof rgbajabob!
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ramuma53
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rgbajabob
Yes my name is Rafael Muñoz Martinez, I do not hide my identity or my background or even my family, can you do the same?
A lot of people know me in Rosarito and Mulege and La Paz and Los Cabos; I dare you to just go in to the Rosairto´s Beach and ask any but any of the
merchants there, if they know me, or do the same at the Popotla fish market or the Bernito Juarez market or El Campito fisherman´s town or Venustiano
Carranza town or any of the Rosarito´s newsman, just stop the first person you find on those places and they tell you who I am; can we do the same
with your name?
Sorry but I have never sued Hugo Torres Chavert and of course I never lost any sue against him, so you are openly lying or just don´t know what you
are talking about.
Also, I am sorry to tell you, I do not have any court case that is mine, open in any court at this time and I can tell you, I have been accused in
criminal court of many things, but I have always been found innocent, I have never been found guilty in any court, ever.
Sorry, but I am not being sued, nor in Rosarito nor in Mulege and in the Turtle thread, the one in criminal court is Olivia Higera Aguilar, not me, so
please at least read and think before you write, if you can of course.
On the facts I mention, I mention articles of the Mexican law, that anyone can check on any law library and feel free, to ask me for any law, you
cannot find, so you are wrong about me not showing solid evidence.
No, I do not claim, to be the only one, who have this information, a lot of people have it and that is the problem.
I am just one of the few that make it public, I cannot claim to be the only one, because I have heard that some lady in a Rosarito Radio Station, is
talking openly about this, the problem is, it is in Spanish and in a Mexican radio station, that no American listen to. Also, I have to mention Nancy
Conroy from the Gringo Gazette, who made this public until Hugo Torres Chavert stole his newspapers and sued her out of town, in a great insult to the
liberty of information and expression and of course to the Rosarito´s people.
The problem is that from all those people, who know about this, all the 1000s of attorneys, public notaries, real estate agents and public officials,
who attended my public lectures, at the COPLADEN official meeting, in the Tijuana city hall or at the Tijuana Commerce Chamber, none of them is
denouncing the fraud being committed against the American buyer, not even the San Diego Union reporters who had all the information.
I am not talking about a theory, I am talking about articles of the law in action today and at the time of the legal events, I am talking about Public
Registry annotations that you yourself, can go and check, after all, it was the first 20 annotations on the first book in the Tijuana´s books, that
even you can check yourself.
You claim to know a lot, how come you do not share what you know, I cannot be more open if you have real questions.
At this time, you are acting just like the other Hugo Torres Chavert and developer´s advocates, a lot of words, but very few content, insulting in the
sadows and talking like if you knew more, than the people who take the time to read this thread and do some investigation, that will help other
American buyers, because that is the issue here, to share information that will be useful to people and help them on how to spend judiciously
their hard earned money.
If you have information that helps people on that issue, feel free to share it here, even if you can uncover me in any wrong doing, or discredit with
arguments what I say here, but, be aware, that many people have tried before and failed always, even high level professionals have failed to disprove
what I say, but try, why not one more.
[Edited on 4-19-2011 by ramuma53]
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
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Exactly what was said
| Quote: | Originally posted by rgbajabob
This guy Ramuma53, aka rafael munoz is so full of it his eyes are brown!! Stop listening to him...as you can tell he loves to have an audience....has
anyone actualy checked out his "facts" I doubt it. have any of you met him? I doubt it as well...Why not ask the americans whose homes he has
confiscated with dubious paperwork??? They exist, he even listed them on the turtle bust thread. He is just a salesman for himself and loves any
chance to discredit Torres, who he was suing ( and lost!) again...This is all a stage for him to bring attention to his attempts to win his court
cases....here in rosarito and in Mulege where he is still being sued although he denies it (check the turlte thread)
He just quotes "facts---his facts" and expects you to believe him...he never presents solid evidence just spouts off verbage and it seems some of you
buy it and actually thank him...amazing......It's like taking cooking lessons from Hannibal Lector.....You are just encouraging him to build his soap
box higher and higher! Funny, among all the lawyers and legal experts he is the only one to have this information.....it is all a big plot and he is
the only one with the answers....doesn't this seem strange to any of you?? I know, he only wants to help everyone.....ssshhhsssh!
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Don't think there has been a lack of disclosure on one individuals posts.. rather quite a bit of "information" on a number of issues relating to "land
ownership" in the State of Baja, and Mexico also...
Just for the record... this is what this one individual has posted in this "thread" ... if you wish I can post all.. it's 192 pages of posts from this
one individual.. as I have been taking notes.. for my own information on Real Estate due diligence in Mexico..
Has been very informative for me.. know how it works in the States to get the history and use of a site .. but, learning the neceassary Agency's to
contact to document a "sites" history is a great asset in any real estate transaction... and if your buying land in Baja and/or Mexico ... why would
this not be good information to develop..
As for verification of what has been stated, thus far, I have not found anything which would negate what has been posted as it relates to
determination of Title by the Laws and Agency's of Mexico and/or Baja, to date.. I will continue with this project as it is something which effects
many people .... including Mexican Nationals ... I would imagine .... plus i don't really have anything pressing, at the moment...
One addition, this individual is a Mexican National, who posts in ENGLISH... meaning, he can speak and write clearly in another language.. which to me
means a lot, as I have a hard time with just english... thanks for the help...
posted on 1-9-2011 at 13:32
Baja Real Estate advise
For those that have questions about Real Estate aquisition in Baja.
The real thing, not for the people who think that, just having confidence on a public notary si enough.
Baja is considered all ver Mexico as a very difficult place to buy for foreigners and nationals alike.
The lack of confidence has scared most of the would be buyers in Baja California on the Ensenada Tijuana strip and the local authorities, have taken
advantage of this problem instead of correcting it, if you have questions about the real state of afairs on Real Estate, make your questions here.
I am the "La Verdadera Historia de Rosarito" and "Cronica de un fraude a la Nacion" author, publications on the ABC Estate newspaper and several
national publications, concerning the Real Estate problem in Baja, 30 years experience on the subject.
posted on 1-9-2011 at 17:54
Yes of course I know about that problem and I advised the authorities about that particular problem several years ago and you know by their inaction
that the problem building just finished construction.
The guy who is talking in the video, is fundamentally wrong about one thing, the building is not inside the Federal Zone, because it is out of the
Federal zone legal line (The sea took ground after the legal line was established in 1976 because of the CFE breakwater); I know that the building
looks, like just on top of the beach, but the Federal zone legal line is west of the building and that is why Federal Zone can not intervene, also
about the access for the impaired, the Federal Zone law say, that there must be at least one beach access, every 800 meters and clearly there are
beach accesses inside the 800 mts.
The Federal Zone office can and must correct the legal line defining the Federal Zone in that area, according to the law, as ground gained by the sea,
but that procedure has never been done, it must be done, but in the mean while the building is not inside the Federal Zone and not wrong about that
issue.
The real reason that building is wrong, is because it is in National Land being subjected at this time, to a sale procedure by the SRA, file 507710 by
the National Land office, being legally sold to another person, not related to the guy who built the tower and that is true also for the other beach
front towers south of there.
I can tell you what is going to happen there in the future: when the sale procedure, for Rancho Costa Azul finishes, the Federal police will bring
anyone they find in the building, to Mexico city to be prosecuted for illegal use of National Land, that already happened 2 years ago to the guy who
said he was the owner of the disco Animale in Rosarito downtown.
This is only one of hundreds of problems in the Rosarito area that will erupt in the near future, like the one in Playa Encantada, the one near the
Corona Hotel and a lot others.
posted on 1-9-2011 at 18:47
Also, bout what you can legally do, about that problem?
As any Mexican can do, ask the Federal Zone to re define the boundary line, defining the Federal Zone in that area; they may not want to accept your
petition, but if they do not accept it, just mail it to them officially with copy to every authority in the chain of command up to the President.
It may take years and a lot of effort, but you can do it, also do what you are doing, raise the issue publicly as often as you can, to hurry up the
process.
What will you accomplish with that? That the line, be redefined and the building included in the Federal zone, they will have to pay for the Federal
zone from that point at a very expensive price and that may make the building not rentable.
Also when they start having legal problems with the real owner, together with criminal charges by the Federal authorities, they may just settle for
leaving the place as too expensive and then the building will be demolished.
I agree, it is not right to be there, but legally it is right at this time, but if you do not do the right thing and confront the authorities, they
will just go on, because we know the Federal Zone authorities in Rosarito are very crooked.
posted on 1-10-2011 at 15:07
Woooosh
As you say, either way the buildings are still illegal. We hold the federal concession title and pay every year for it (11 pesos per square meter)- we
just don't have control of it's use- as our concession title requires us to. The SEMARNAT Jefe required us to file charges against the squatter Ortiz
with the PGR. I do hope they start prosecuting others as you say. Great insight. If you know of people who can move the prosecution process forward on
this, U2U me. PROFEPA, SEMARNAT, JPGE and the PGR all have active files on this specific concession area: DZGF 832/08 and DZGF 477/10. Much thanks!
Hope to here from you! Woooosh
Your charges against the squater are one of the best ways to get back the use of theFederal Zone, but you must press it every step of the way, but if
you hold the concession you have the legal use of that area, then, the act of taking it away from you, is a criminal act with federal jurisdiction.
You are doing the right legal thing, but you must know the Mexican Justice system, it is difficult to move, but once you make it move, it will do the
job very effciently and to make it move you have to step on their toes.
posted on 1-10-2011 at 16:26
Lobsterman
Mexico is not different from other places concerning buying real estate, but Foreigners buying real estate do not know the Mexican complexities
concerning property titles and let me explain you a little bit, because there are different kind of property titles:
ARTICLE 27 FROM THE MEXICAN CONSTITUTION SAY THAT ALL THE LAND INSIDE THE MEXICO BORDERS IS BY ORIGIN NATIONAL LAND AND TO TAKE IT OUT OF NATIONAL
LAND STATUS, YOU HAVE TO DO IT THROUGH A LEGAL TITE GIVEN BY THE NATIONAL LAND OFFICE ONLY.
And that “Only” is a very problematic “only”, because there is absolutely no other way, and that mean, that no judge, governor or any but any other
authority can give you a title that is legal over National land, also there is no status of limitations that affect National Land.
We have then, TITLES ISSUED BY THE NATIONAL LAND OFFICE (SRA) and those are the best kind of private property titles AND EVERY PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHT,
MUST HAVE ONE OF THOSE AS PRECEDENT, the problem is that, in Baja, most lots don't have one as precedent and the public notary supposed to be the one
to advise the buyer about that critical fact, but the other problem in Baja, is that they don’t, like most of the Rosarito developments, especially
the ones built by the Hugo Torres Chavert group.
We also have, EJIDO TITLES and those titles, say on them, FULL DOMINIUM, but it is only partially true, because, to be able to buy property, coming
from one of those titles, you have to follow up, a very difficult and lengthily process (up to 10 years) that include an authorization by the Ejido
group, whose assembly have to meet, with a majority of the ejidatarios, a public notary have to be there and certify that they did it legally and a
federal representative must be there for the same purpose. Believe me, it is very difficult to put that together, also, the ejido must be free of any
civil or administrative procedure and free of debt; once you put that together, they can give you an authorization to bring that lot, out of the Ejido
land, take that authorization to Mexico city and get a SRA authorization to take it out of Ejido Land and only then, it is private property, any other
way it is still Ejido Land and that mean, you have to obey the Ejido rules while they are able to get the property back for any reason without giving
you money back and of course, be a Mexican; Since all the Baja Ejidos, are all wrong and do not have legal technical works, the ejidos do not know
what their land is (of course they say they do) and have not received any land, in a legal way and as a consequence, NO EJIDO IN BAJA CAN SELL YOU
LAND FREE OF PROBLEMS; as a consequence, I will never advise any people to buy from a Baja Ejido; that is what doomed the American buyers in Punta
Banda, they bought from the Ejido, believed the Baja Governor, that they will not have problems and lost against a National Land title; you may say,
that they didn’t knew the complexities, but I personally advised the American Consulate in Tijuana what will happen, they consulted the Baja Governor
who told them, there would be no problems and you know what happened.
We have also COLONIAL TITLES that say on them, PROPERTY TITLES, but then, in small letters, say that the owners, must obey the Colonial Law and a
whole lot of problems come from those letters.
Colonial titles are not really property titles, they are very similar to a free land concession, that the Mexican government gave to people, to
motivate them, to go exploit and live on the land and have those conditions to be met, some people went and registered them as private property titles
on the public registry and have been selling for many years as private property but:
Colonial titles are not full private titles, are conditional property titles and are the owner property as long as those conditions were met and if
you failed to exploit, live and demonstrate to the land office every year, that you were living and exploiting the land, they simply disappeared and
didn’t gave the owner any legal property right and that mean that, if the original owner did not report the exploitation for 2 years, the title became
worthless; that is the case for a lot of Ensenada, San Quintin, La Paz and Los Cabos titles, like the Maravia title.
If you were living and reporting he exploitation, you were able to sell those titles, to a third person, but not as normal private property, you had
to follow a special procedure, to be able to do it legally; you were obligated to tell the buyer the kind of title he was buying, because he had to
obey the same rules, bring him to the SRA and land office, to execute the sale with them, then they issued another new title on the name of the new
buyer, obligated to the same rules; and that mean, that nobody can say, that he have one of those titles as precedent, because to be a legal title,
the title must be on his name, no way around this.
Those titles were so problematic, that most of the Baja Colonies never started and most titles were void, then in 1994, all the Colonial titles were
void and the very few, that were complying with the law and colony rules, were exchanged by National Land titles and that mean, nobody under any
circumstances, can say, that their property, have as precedent, a Colonial title and that is the case for Maravia development in La Paz and be aware,
that they claim to have a Stewart title insurance and also an American title insurance, but they simply do not have a legal title and are immersed in
legal problems because of that.
But the main problem I see in Baja, is that, the public notaries, who are the government delegates to check the property for you, on those matters and
responsible for advising you about any problems, simply in Baja, they do not do it, they just check if another public notary made the last inscription
and no more, raising the very real and problematic fact, THAT MOST PROPERTIES IN ROSARITO, ENSENADA, LA PAZ AND LOS CABOS HAVE VOID TITLES AS
PRECEDENT, casing the problems you face.
But, of course, the public notary will not lose his life savings, if the precedent tile is questioned in court, you will, then, you must check the
precedents in what is known as the devil test and that mean, that when you are going to buy a property in Baja, you must check all the property’s
precedents, all the way to the National Land office title THAT MUST BE AT THE BOTTOM, and, if you find any other kind of title, just walk away and do
not let the public notary or any other people, say otherwise. Not even the American Consulate or the Baja Governor, as Punta Banda “owners” found out
the hard way.
IF YOU FOLLOW THIS RULES STRICTLY, YOU CAN BUY PROPERTY IN BAJA SAFELY, DO NOT FOLLOW THEM ND YOU CERTAINLY WILL HAVE PROBLEMS AND LOSE YOUR HOUSE.
posted on 1-10-2011 at 16:50
Woooosh
Beside doing the right thing I will give you one of the best advices I can give for your problem, look for an engineer named Daniel Martinez Chavira
at the Engineers club in Rosarito and use him as your expert witness, he is one of the best technical experts in the Rosarito's Federal Zone and once
he is on your side, he will fight like a dog for you, without making any concessions; he know that particular area problem very well and is very
respected in Rosarito by all Rosarito’s authorities.
He is authorized by the Federal Zone and all the Baja courts as a technical expert, he won the CFE against the ejido case and most of the big cases in
Rosarito.
He is eccentric but not expensive.
posted on 1-10-2011 at 22:38
Woooosh
If I wanted to be a troublemaker and put my locks on the gates the squatter has in place around the house sitting on our concession- how much trouble
would I get in? Can I lock her off? Seems if she can paint over my concession signs and attempt to sell the concession land, I should be able to lock
her off my concession. The concession title says I am the only one entitled to use it. Maybe it's time for me to put the pressure on her for a change.
Since you alrready started legal procedures and mande a formal comlaint accepting that he is there, that mean you accepted that he has posession, a
posession that you claim is not legal and is yours, but you alrready accepted that he has an illegitimate posesion, then if you take that posesion
away without a court order, you wuld be commiting a crime known as despojo and will be prosecuted for that crime.
If you hadn't accepted in a formal way her posession, then you would be right, because it is a lot less expensive to just defend your property and
lock averybody out than go to court, but if you already made the formal complaint about her illegal ocupation, do not do it, she would be able to put
you in jail and believe me, if she put a little money behind her legal actions, you would have given the property away.
If you acted legally, continue acting legally.
woooosh
Do not worry about being a troublemaker, if you have legal reason, the troublemakers are the only ones who win in court, because if you are not a
troublemaker, then you allow corruption on the other side to act, but if you are a troublemaker for the authorities, then it become expensive for the
other side and cheap for you and that fact may be the descisive point.
posted on 1-11-2011 at 10:52
Woooosh
Ok I told you he is a little eccentric and that fact is because he is one of the best engineers in Baja, he only work on the cases he likes, actually
he has a master degree and a lot of credential, he does not have a cell phone, only a nextel radio 152*15*5874 and his email is dmch_2008@hotmail.com
and that is it, tell him I refered you to him, because he does not accept many cases, but you can be sure, he will accept yours.
Talk to him about your problem without any compromise, he will give you his opinion and a proposed way of action and believe me, when he has to fight,
he does it better than any other but he know a lot of ways concerning Federal Zone.
posted on 1-11-2011 at 10:57
Woooosh
That is the right way to work in Mexico and the only way to get results, the public offivcials at first hate you and will try to block you but when
the heat get high on them, they become your friends, sorry but that is the mexican way and I preffer not to complain about it, just use it to the full
extent.
Also Mother nature will hrelp you, that building will not last the next big storm, it is actually dangerous to its ocupants.
posted on 1-11-2011 at 11:00
bajabass
You are right here in Mexico and any other place in the world, but now that you know how to obtain results in Mexico, it is only a matter of doing it
when you need it and that is this thread's goal.
You are wrong about the fact that when you make a lot of noise, it becomes expensive for the noisy party, it works the other way, noise save you money
and corruption offers, they actually start to fear you and become your friends, helping you at the same time, remember that they are there as a
business and they will not jeopardize their business for any deal in particular, even if they received money, they prefer to go to the side making the
most noise and have the legal reason.
posted on 1-11-2011 at 13:27
Woooosh
I am not a realtor and have never been.
I am civil Engineer and attorney at Mexican law, plus 25 years experience as expert withness on those matters, that is why I know the good and bad
expert withnesses.
Yes I was 50% owner of ABC Baja Estate newspaper where I wrote La Verdadera Historia de Rosarito and Cronica de un Fraude a la Nacion, series articles
that lasted 5 years and 122 whole pages, exactly about that problem in Rosarito.
Now I consider myself just a developer.
Yes you may be a just a gringo in Rosarito, but remember that almost 80% of the Rosarito's income and taxes comes direct or indirect from Gringos and
I learned that when I ran for the Natinal Senate office for Baja.
posted on 1-11-2011 at 13:33
For people who need it.
I have a personal documents file, starting in 1825, that is better than most public offices, concerning the Tijuana to Ensenada corridor, incluiding
official newspapers and official federal zone maps, that you can not get any other place and I can provide that for specific problems.
posted on 1-11-2011 at 13:49
wessongroup
Concerning the Rosarito's realtors, I am sorry to say it, but you can not trust most of them, they are in bed with the people who caused the problems
and their only interest is in getting your money and get their commision, not to protect your life savings.
Public notaries, are not the solution, they are part of the problem.
Attorneys? be extremely carfull, only 1 in 10 are good and know what they are talking about concerning Federal Zone and National land.
Public officials? no way, they are itersted in maintaining the problems.
Who to trust? nobody, trust your own knowledge and follow your instinct.
I am going to tell you an attorney's joke.
On the question on how to diferentiate a good from a bad attorney.
Take a cat with you the first time you meet with him.
if the cat gets angry and try to attack him, do not use him.
if the cat is afraid of him, use him.
Why?
Because if the attroney is a rat, the cat will attack him and if he fight like a dog, the cat would be afraid of him.
make yourown conclusions.
posted on 1-13-2011 at 19:57
wessongroup
La verdadera Historia de Rosarito is the True Rosarito history.
The reason to write a true history is because the History a lot of people invented was a fairy tale and on that fairy tale, they were trying to base
the Real Estate sales in Rosarito.
The first article was ¨Cronica de un Fraude a la Nacion¨ or ¨fraud against the Nation story¨ and was motivated on the Fraud that a lot of realtors and
big land owners were trying to execute in harm to the national land property.
The then accepted history was that Joaquin Machado was the Rancho Rosarito owner in 1879 and supposedly he inherited the property from his father Don
Juan Machado who received it from the Governor don Jose Maria Echendia in 1825, but I discovered the legal root to demonstrate that that Property
right was inexistent and as a consequence, all the Rosarito Area was in 1995 National Land and not private property as everyone assumed.
posted on 1-16-2011 at 16:48
LarryC
The fideicomiso is a glorified lease contract, collateralized by the bank, the bank serve as the legal rights depository for the life of the
fideicomiso and being a lease contract, it has no limit but the constitutional one for 2500 has or 25'000,000 m2, I know a lot of fideicomisos a lot
bigger than that and dealing with tourist kind of lot, they have lower limit of 400 m2 but no upper limit.
The lot sizes depend o the Fraccionamiento law or land development law and that law say that a 2000 m2 lot is called granja failiar or family lot but
that is a minimum also no upper limit for family lots and being categorized like that mean that the developer is not obligated to put pavment or
concrete on the streets, he is obligaed only to the bare bones public installations.
posted on 1-16-2011 at 17:13
Mark
If you rent or lease you will not have problems, but the usual situation in Baja is that the American guy, rent long term to be able to build a house
that he is planning to use for his golden years walking the beach.
The problem with National Land is that they do not have any hurry to start the problems, they usually wait untill the area is developed and then the
problem start, that is exactly the case for Punta Banda in Ensenada, and that was the case that exploded the Real Estate crisis in the Tijuana
Ensenada coastal strip, because the Supreme Court ruled for National Land.
After that, it is only a matter of time, it is a big time bomb and local politicians have tried to hide that fact for 20 years now, but for National
Land rights there is no status of limitations or any time limit, they can start today or in 20 years when the strip would be full of towers bought and
paid by Baby Boomers,
Just see the 3 tower complexes built by the Hugo Torres Chavert group; the 3 are on National Land already sold by the nation to another people.
To be able to sell while many people know about the very high risk, they invented the in house title insurance, in other words, the same company based
in Islas del Caiman in the Caribbean, sell the insurance, well even the company is named Los Gatos or the cats, and I think that they did it to mean
that they will be very hard to catch when they start running.
That is why Hugo Torres Chavert has been so interested in occupying city offices at all costs.
My first article on the public press in Baja was Cronica de un fraude a la Nacion and that story has not ended yet.
To avoid this problem, in 1992, I maneuvered in Mexico city to convince the National Land department to come to the Rosarito area to regularize the
land ownership and I managed to bring a small commission, but they expected to acquire 20 or 30 files and sent personnel for that job; then in 3
months they received 5,500 files and almost went crazy working 20 hours a day.
Then the first PAN governor, Governor Ruffo, asked the President to end the land regularization in Rosarito, because it was too conflictive and
tourist would be scared away if they knew all the land lots and condominiums were not really owned by the people receiving the money from them and
managed to close the commission with only 4 or 5 titles issued while at the same time in Puebla they issued 16,000 to an area with the same problems
and let me tell you, that area now has no problems while Rosarito is in a Real Estate chaos.
Yes that made me a very popular guy in Rosarito, with the big land owners and developers who were tying at all cost to put the national land issue
under the rug and they succeeded, with the actual situation resulting.
I was unpopular with them, but gained me the nomination to the National senate for Baja, I lost of course because I was issued $10,000 pesos for my
whole campaign, money that was lost and never arrived anyway, but I managed to bring the highest number of votes in any estate for that party, most of
them in the Rosarito Area.
The Rosarito Story has not ended, it will, with a lot of Punta Bandas and I hope that, with this information, many Americans avoid getting entangled
in that problem, saving Mexico another fiasco.
posted on 1-23-2011 at 09:16
Baja Guy
That Project is just an example, of the kind of problems in that area, but the problem is not that complex.
Rule 1.- Do not buy in the Tijuana, Ensenada Coastal strip, unless they show you the national land Title, they will tell you 1000 excuses, but No
national Land title, no buy, that is easy and I warn you, there are very few and none of the big developments have one, specially the La Joya del Mar
development in Rosarito or the one you mention Esmeralda del mar.
Why? They are over National land that has not been cleared by the courts or formally sold by the National Land offcice and at this time is National
land, that is why they offer the ¨in house title insurance¨, exactly the legal act that defines that area as national Land is ¨Declaratoria de
Terrenos Nacionales 1952¨ they will tell you that the Torres group has an impeccable reputation, but it is not true, all their developments are in
national Land or irregular properties and under very unreliable companies, like ¨Los Gatos¨ a Caiman island company, that hold the one in Rosarito
downtown, they claim to have bought the land from the Ejido Mazatlan but they certainly know they bought National Land on false grounds and remember
that National Land has no status of limitations, anyone who buys there, should be aware that they are in line for another Punta Banda.
In Mexico City the National Land office has procedures that in time will take back that land, to the rightful owners, they take a long time but they
certainly end one day, like Punta Banda.
On that strip, The key to buy land, is, National land title or no buy, do not hear the public notary or public officials, they are the source of the
problem, not the people who will correct it, they are very interested in hiding the National Land issue, but it has surfaced again and again for 25
years and it is not going out.
Some people will question what use is to know history about a place and let me tell you why.
PEOPLE WHO DO NOT KNOW HISTORY, IS CONDEMNED TO REPEAT THE SAME MISTAKES
Sun Tzu wrote in the art of war, that, if you do some things, you will be sure to win a conflict and if you do not do those things, you would be sure
to lose the conflict, this is the case, if you follow that rule, you will be able to buy safely in Baja. You will be asked to violate this rule by
many people you should be able to trust, do not.
They certainly know of the problem, they know of the correcting action they need to take, but since they are over national Land, they do not want to
buy from the nation the land again, mostly because the price is about USD$100.00 dlls/m2, but they are selling it to you, at over USD$3,500.00 dlls/m2
built, they surely have room to correct the problem, but so far, they have been trying to hide the fact at all costs. In my opinion a stupid act, but
that is the actual situation.
posted on 1-23-2011 at 09:32
Key factors to buy in Baja
1.- Do not buy from Ejidos unless you are prepared to spend years in courts.
2.- Do not buy from Colonial Titles, no exceptions.
3.- If you only are show a Public Notary scripture, follow it back untill you find the property´s source, it must be a national Land title, no
exceptions, no court orders, no court rullings, no historic titles issued 1879-1917 even if National land titles, No national land titles 1965-1969.
4.- do not hear public notaries or public offcials asuring you everything is right, only trust your knowledge.
Now, oportunities
Most people do not know that the Federal Zone laws changed in 1992 and the 20 mts. from the sea strip rule do no apply anymore.
The new Federal Zone definition is:
Where the coast show a beach and the solid ground beside the beach has a slope of 30 degrees or less, a federal zone will be measured.
That mean, that if you are beside a cliff, the slope is well over 30 degrees and no Federal Zone exist consequently you should not be paying for it.
Do not belive the Rosarito public officials on this issue, Rosarito beach city income, come 25% from Federal zone charges and 90% of those charges are
to properties beside cliffs, that have no Federal Zone.
We have won a lot of cases for people who were being charged for a Federal Zone that does not exist and this apply all over Mexico since the Federal
Zone law is a Federal one.
posted on 1-23-2011 at 09:52
How to recover your money once you bought land and problems explode when some people claim to own that land specially if they have a National Land
title and the developer not.
You may be covered by a Title insurance issued by First American Title insurance or Stewart title insurance, most others are just sellers for those
two; if you do try to ask them to pay for your house, but be aware that they put a lot of fine print to protet themselves, so when you buy, read the
fine print and check yourself the property papers, don not fully trust them, they make a lot of mistakes, just see the Maravia development in La Paz
or La Joya del mar in Rosarito with an in house title insurance.
If not, you will be paying for not following the rules to buy in Baja and you will be crying like the Punta banda guys.
posted on 1-24-2011 at 18:22
Mark
Yes I know, but our authorities are to blame for this one, they make things so difficult, that difficulties pile up and nobody wants to do things the
right way.
This make buying property in some of Mexico´s Estates very difficult, if not impossible, like Baja Norte and a little less Baja South, but most of
Mexico Estates have the property ownership well established and that make easy to buy and sell property, but in Baja Norte, in 1992, when the PAN
party took the estate, they made of property stealing a way of getting funds for the party and made a mess of the public registry in Baja Norte.
In 1992 Governor Ruffo took the Estate and his cousin started Punta Banda making deals with an ejido, you know the Punta Banda embarrassment for
Mexico and Pan party is about to go out of power everywhere.
That year or 1992, I sent a report to the Federal government, about the Tijuana Ensenada coastal strip land ownership problem, and they knowing that
that strip was very important for tourism, immediately sent a National Land office commission, to correct the problems and make the property ownership
less cucumber some and dangerous, they sent a 5 person team expecting to get a few files a month, but they got 6000 the first month, they informed
Mexico city and expected urgent help, reporting my report true and a chaos in the land ownership, because most of the land was still National Land and
almost everybody was a squatter including the Rosarito town leaders like Hugo Torres Chavert, who where basing they supposed property in titles
declared nil by the Constitution.
Instead of help, Governor Ruffo asked the Mexico President Salinas to take out that commission, because he had land on the coast, that they claimed
was national Land; The president knowing that Ruffo was the first Pan and non PRI Governor, just took off the commission and land ownership froze in
Baja Norte with the actual situation erupting, letting him hang himself and his party and at the same time punishing the first estate who voted PRI
out of power.
Governor Ruffo was trying to avoid paying to the nation for his illegally acquired land and put the whole estate in jeopardy, jeopardy that turned in
to real danger and damage today.
Pan will certainly lose power in the Estate in 3 years more, but we start to see signs that the government want to correct the problem and recognize
that almost all the Tijuana to Ensenada coastal strip is National Land and now ask for that commission that started work in 1992 to finish their job.
That will make easy and safe to buy land in Baja north.
Until then, I can only warn you and tell you how to avoid the dangers, it is possible, but you have to know how, also remember that when you have a
knowhow and things are difficult, that open a door of opportunity for the one who know.
posted on 1-25-2011 at 20:13
----- Original Message -----
From: William J. Casey, Jr.
To: director@munoz-industries.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 12:31 PM
Subject: Please call me at 686.577.6228 or in U.S. at 408.868.4992
We are a group of 200+ “buyers” of real estate that have been defrauded in San Felipe.
You can see the story written by ZETA on 2JAN2011.
We are trying to work with the new Mexicali Major “Pancho” Tejeda, but it seems like he will do nothing to help us.
We have forums on Facebook, Yahoo Groups and EONS.
Maybe we could work together to get action on the rampant developer and government corruption in Baja California.
www.sanfelipedevelopments.com
http://www.zetatijuana.com/html/EdicionActual/Reportajez_Mil...
The zeta article is not visible at the URL you sent me, but I will look for it, thank you.
Regarding that problem, you are right, even if the new majors are PRI party now, I do not expect them to start correcting a problem that started when
Governor Ruffo started.
I do not know what legal avenues are you taking, but if you let me know, I will certainly advise you on the exact legal way you will need to acquire
legal land status and that mean legal title that will stand in time.
I know about the land property problem in that area, since most of that area is national land but with titles issued in several ways, so please send
me the exact problems and I will be able to send you the exact title concerning that site, because that area is known as El Moreno and there are a lot
of titles with 100 Has. each, I am sending you one of those titles to see if we are talking about the same area.
There are several options depending on your exact information:
1.- You problem arises from a lack of a National land title
Then you are in a Federal Fraud against the nation a against you of course, but the main player would be the federal government and you the help, but
in that case you can ask for your money back, as a compensation, name a Mexican national representative and holding your absolute confidence, sign
contracts with him and make him claim that property to the National Land office, it takes time and follow procedures, but you will end up with a legal
ownership through a fideicomiso if you are foreigner or direct ownership if you are a Mexican national, also you must know that if your lot is near
the sea, the price you will pay to the nation will be about USD$100.00 dlls/m2.
2.- Your problem arises from the existence of a national title but lack of development permits and that mean lack of F1, F2, F3 and F4 permits, the
last one signed by the governor.
That mean you are going to follow the Estate law and common criminal case as Fraude Equiparado against the developer, who would be responsible for
fraud and must return your investment plus damages; that is the law, but if the guy know what he is doing, he can extend that for 10 years until you
all forget about him, unless you press hard on the international press.
Hope this will help you but this is as much as I can help with the information you give me.
Ing. & Lic. Rafael Muñoz Martinez
posted on 1-25-2011 at 20:21
BajaGringo
If the title they are showing, is the national Land title, known as the Orendain title that cover most of San Quintin town but not the coastal area,
you may have hope, but if not, you will certainly will be over National land, that may have been a Colony and have colonial titles, that at this time,
are worthless, the titles may say on them, Property title, but if you see the fine print, you will find ¨issued under the Colony Law¨or Ley de
Colonias and if you find that law you will see why those titles are worthless, they also disapeared in 1994 and few that were exploited acording to
the law, were exchanged by National land titles, with full property rights so, the colonial titles that exist now, even if registered as private
property, are worthless and the only way to acquire real ownership would be to obtain a National Land title based on posession only.
posted on 1-26-2011 at 08:53
From: William J. Casey, Jr.
To: 'Rafael Munoz'
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 12:36 AM
Subject: RE: Please call me at or in U.S. at
The Baja Property owners cooperative is made up of fraud victims from over 17 developments in and around San Felipe.
Attached please find one “title” for one such development: Vista Bella
Like most other frauds in san felipe, this “developer” took money and did not deliver individual titles or the utilities or roads, and He is not
working to get the f4.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mr. William Casey
If they received money, before having the F4 permit that include the governor signature, with title or without it, it is called FRAUDE EQUIPARADO and
has a 6 to 12 years criminal penalty in Baja California.
This felony is committed by any person who make any kind of development (roads, services etc.) before the F4 permit.
The F4 permit, is the definitive land development authorization issued by the Estate government, signed by the Estate governor, authorizing the
definitive shape the development will hold, assuring the future buyers that there will be no future changes in urban design, including green areas and
donation to the government that total about 10% of the saleable area;defining the roads and services authorization by each of the services providers,
water, sewage disposal and electricity with also the Estate land usage permit and Federal environmental permit; all those have to be issued before the
F4; meaning that when you have F4, you are in developer´s heaven and if not, you are in developer´s hell and maybe in jail.
To get the F4, may take years or never, while you legally are liable for Fraude Equiparado, if you even try to sell, or make development works, in any
way before you have F4, liable for 6 to 12 years in jail penalty.
This is designed to protect the buyer from urban or lot changes or buying in a place that does not have all the qualities for urban development and
that may be your case.
I think that, they may be lacking legal title or federal enviromental permit and in consequence, the F4 permit has not been issued while may never be
and they are in between a rock and a hard place with you, because they cannot give you legal title or development acts (roads or services), because if
they do it, they would be instantly liable for criminal acts and they prefer to deal with you instead of the Estate government.
I know part of that area, has been rendered Biosphere reserve and in consequence, not usable for development and that may be the problem for the
issuing of the F4 permit, but that does not change the fact that you are the victim in a Fraude Equiparado, a common law criminal act, but if you put
on the table, the National Land factor and the Biosphere reserve prohibition, you may well be, also before some Federal crimes.
I think that the best way of action for your group is to file individual criminal charges, but keep them together, because you should know that in
Mexico there are no class actions and criminal or civil charges must be filled by each person, because any ruling will benefit only the ruled party.
I expect you to have very little help from the Estate authorities and some from the city authorities, but this case should be under Estate
jurisdiction and or Federal Jurisdiction and in both cases they may be in bed with the developers while the City official may not.
Concerning attorneys, I would consider getting a Mexico city law firm without ties to Baja California and using the fact that you have federal crimes
involved, use the Mexcio city judges and police to investigate the case with help form the American embasy.
Also, as you are Foreigners, you should be protected by Fideicomisos and that mean that the bank is the one that should be the legally interested
party, because they are the ones who will have to give you back your money in case of the fideicomiso default.
If you are not under a fideicomiso, you are in deep troubles but that mean we will have to find other ways and believe me, there are a lot of ways.
Ing. & Lic. Rafael Muñoz Martinez
From: William J. Casey, Jr.
To: 'Rafael Munoz'
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 11:09 AM
Subject: RE: Please call me at 686.577.6228 or in U.S. at 408.868.4992
At the Mexicali Urban Department under the previous Municipal Presidente, (2) administrators (Magana and Sanchez) were known to be corrupt. They did
not stop the 17+ developers from selling without permits.
Some of the failed “developments” are in the biosphere, but this has not stopped urbanization from issuing F4s in this area (El Dorado Ranch and Playa
De Oro for example).
We have filed 50++ complaints with PROFECO, but they have done nothing to help. We worked with both PROFECO-Mexicali and PROFECO-Mexico City.
The problem is that the PGJE and the court system in San Felipe is also known to be corrupt. Several of our members have won their case, their appeal
and also the Supreme Court challenge… yet the judge NEVER has awarded any of them with clear title to the land they paid for!
So:
· Feds have done nothing (we have even been in contact with the Mexican Ambassador in D.C.)
· BC state has done nothing (we worked with the Director of the BC Tourism for several months with no success), and
· Mexicali has done nothing
The person that the Urban Administration has “put in charge” of the San Felipe land scams is now Monica Perez. Monica is the niece of Ascolani (Mayor
Pancho Tejada’s #1 advisor) and is also believed to have been the secretary for Miguel Sanchez, who was #2 at Mexicali Urban Administration when all
the frauds were allowed to happen due to lax enforcement of all municipal regulations.
Unless we get the government to crack down, the crooked “developers” will continue their fraud.
We will be ramping up our campaign to involve our contacts in the U.S. Congress and the press.
We should talk.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Mr. Casey
I know Magana and definitively he is corrupt and of course, that was their business, allowing illegal developments and making it difficult for land
developers to get the F4, so they would have to pay them for it, big amounts and even a few development blocks.
PROFECO has only recommendation powers, will not solve anything by itself but it is possible it may help.
Criminal charges will never get you clear title, only prosecute the developer; you only hope may be to recover your money through your fideicomiso.
The North Baja PGJE is not only corrupt like few in the world, it depends on the Estate District attorney who may very well re define the word
corruption and will remain so while the PAN is in power, because they protect their officers against all law or logic.
The supreme court in Baja is known as the Persian Market, that mean, you will have to pay for a ruling and the problem is not only that it is
corruption, it is a biding market, if the developer bids more than you, they get the ruling and against that ruling there are no legal recourses.
The whole system is corrupt and designed that way to protect criminal who pay and that is the real enemy, that is why Baja is being reported all over
the world as a none fit place to buy.
The only way I have found to go around them is to use Mexico city courts using federal law and I do not mean that Mexico city courts are honesty
examples, only it is a lot more difficult for the developers to buy them all and at the same time their influence is low, while corruptions is less
expensive.
That is why I advise you to use a well known Mexico city law firm to put all the cases together and on different courts while using the embassy and
press, believe me, that will put them in jeopardy while in Baja they are secured by the system they know corrupt and under their spell.
Mr. Casey, I would be happy to talk to you on the phone at any time, I am in Mexico city, my cell phone is 554 373 8603 and in the past I have advised
the USA Embassy and Baja Consulate, concerning this kind of problems like Punta Banda, but by experience I prefer the email for bulk communications,
because it will be useful for you to have all this in writing.
I can also help you by referring you to professionals who are corruption proof and have been fighting this system for 20 years and wining, because you
should know that Baja’s attorneys are also very adept to making deals between them and very ignorant about National land issues.
I use Mexico´s law firms to handle all my cases in both Bajas, it cost me in traveling expenses, but not as much as to lose cases because corruption
among attorneys.
Ing. & Lic. Rafael Muñoz Martinez
posted on 1-26-2011 at 20:53
Bajagringo
my respects for you, I wish every American were as carefull as you were when they buy property in Mexico, specially in Baja, but I have found that
they suspend logic and some times, intelligence, just assuming that everything in Mexico is crooked naturally and then allowing the most buizarre
things to happen in front of them.
I think you should be their advisor.
posted on 1-27-2011 at 18:43
The only title, you as foreigners can have on the forbiden by the Constiotution strips is through a Fideicomiso, there is no other legal way.
North of San Felipe, there are a lot of national Titles in an area named El Moreno, but that strip has been declared as biosphere reserve and the
Estate is witholding any construction permit until that matter is cleared, but they are taking years to do it and in the mean while, they do not let
the developers give legal title or make development works.
We hope that will change soon, but you never know.
El Dorado Ranch is south of that area and has a national land as precedent, the owner has been trying for years to finish his development legally, but
it looks like he has a lot of problems doing it.
posted on 1-27-2011 at 20:45
La Verdadera Historia de Rosarito
Since we want to learn from other people experience, instead of committing the same mistakes, I will let you know, the True Rosarito Story published
by me, on the ABC newspaper and please let me tell you, that every single fact, I mention here, is backed up, by legal documents, that have been
tested and sustained already in Federal courts.
Around 1810, there was a Penal colony in San Diego California Mexico and the guys who guarded it, were called the LEATHER JACKETS, whose Captain was a
fellow named Don Juan Machado, who made such a good work and impressed so much the territory Governor, that in 1825 the Governor Jose Maria Echendia,
gave him for his services, 2 big cattle sites that had about 19,311.61 Hectares in El Rosario, now Rosarito Beach.
As you know, in 1848 California changed from being Mexico to part of the USA and people born in San Diego, was given the chance to say what country
they wanted to belong, Mexico or USA and Don Juan Machado with his family became USA citizens.
In 1863, the national Land law, was issued by Mexico´s President Benito Juarez, you can consult that law in a book named ¨5 siglos de Legislacion
Agraria de Manuel Fabila ¨ From that law:
Article 2 say, that it was forbidden to any of Mexico´s authorities to give away or sell National Land, specially the Estates governors also that it
was forbidden to any person to own more than 2,500 Hectares, also that it was forbidden to any foreigner and Mexican not living in Mexico, to own any
property in Mexico.
Article 10 say, that if the person who claimed National Land, did not make use of the land by putting on the land, at least 1 person for each 10
hectares, the title will become void.
Article 27 say, any violation to any article of this law rendered the title void and inexistent.
Then Benito Juarez died, the Second Empire Raised and fell and President Porfirio Dias took power in 1876, ending the chaos and starting the civil
government in Mexico.
In 1878, the son of Don Juan Machado, Joaquin Machado Valdez, knowing that his father title was void, claimed the El Rosario Ranch with 19,311
hectares from National Land office, in 1879 the title was issued by the President Porfirio Diaz and the title registered in 1885.
In 1889, a delegate was sent to Rancho El Rosarito owned by Joaquin Machado Valdez, brothers and co proprietors, to check if they had complied with
the law, having at least 1 person for each 10 hectares, or at least 1,931 people, they failed for 500 people bringing even children and the failure to
complain with the law documented officially.
In 1894, President Porfirio Diaz, issued a new National Land law (Ley de Terrenos Nacionales de Don Wistano Luis Orozco), allowing people to own more
than 2,500 hectares of land, but in the exceptions to the law chapter, he say, that you can own as much land you needed, but not more than the amount
of land allowed by the Benito Juarez 1863 law.
President Porfirio Diaz did this, to make a joke of a deal, he had made with American companies that were given ½ of the land, they surveyed in Baja
California, named Compañias Deslindadoras; the American companies, went ahead and surveyed the whole Baja, expecting to own ½ Baja, but the law didn´t
allow them to own more than the 2500 hectares limit, but they didn’t know it and measured the whole Estate, only latter knew of the law prohibition,
but by then the Federal government had already the survey works.
In 1910 Mexican Revolution erupted, Civil war everywhere, to try to overthrow the dictator Porfirio Diaz, who had governed Mexico then for 34 years,
war went over for 5 years, up to 1915.
In 1915 Porfirio Diaz was almost finished and had to go to France in disgrace and without money.
Then, everybody was commenting that the land limit will remain like in 1863, no more than 2,500 hectares will be allowed and the word went all the way
to San Francisco California, where the Machado Family lived away from war, as American citizens.
Joaquin Machado had died as American citizen and is buried that way in California USA.
The then Machado family composed of 11 of Don Joaquin Machado Valdez sons and daughters started to sell the Racho El Rosarito 19,311 Has. In San
Francisco, through the Mexican Consul there; they sold it to a Mexican company born in 1915 in Mexicali B.C. named ¨Compañia Explotadora de la Baja
California¨whose main stock holder, holding 99.8% of the company stock was a Canada Born person named Danzinger, the 2/10 % was owned by 2 Mexicans
and one of them lived in San Diego California, I should add, that they never got a permit to own stock in a Mexican company.
The sales are registered in the number one of Tijuana Public Registry´s book, scriptures number 1 through 19.
In 1916, The named President Carranza, having finished the Revolucion and having overthrown the Dictator Porfirio Diaz, published a presidential
decree (Official newspaper May 7, 1917) declaring that all the Baja California Lands, that were in foreigners hands, returned to the national Land
dominium and property, like the Hartford Connecticut company, making an example of that company.
In 1917, the new constitution was published by The Mexico´s President Don Venustiano Carranza, and it´s 27 article, it say that all the titles issued
between 1876 and 1917 were subjected to revision by the national land office to avoid validate any title that violated the 1863 law.
Knowing that he had just lost all the just acquired land, the Canadian owner of Rancho El Rosarito promptly gave away the El Rosarito Ranch, to his
wife, named Daisy Moreno, an Spanish actress, expecting, that nobody will notice she was not a Mexican, with the name being similar to a Mexican name.
As you see, The Rancho El Rosarito´s area violate the 1863 law, making it, and object outside of the law, not fit to be given away by any authority.
The 1894 law, did not validated that sale, and that mean, that the Joaquin Machado Valdez was inexistent, according to the 1863 law article 27 and
inexistence in those years, was the fact that the legal act, affected by it, never started to exist, in other words, the Joaquin Machado Valdez title,
never started to exist, also, if it ever existed, by violation of the article 10 of the same law, it suffered again of in existence. Simply, there is
no way to argue, that that title exist or have any legal effect, after that, but if something else were needed, when the Machado family sold the land
to a foreign owned company, it came under the effect of the Venustiano Carranza decree, returning those lands to the National Property, if we want to
speculate that at any time, it came out.
I should mention, that when I exposed this information to the COPLADEN official meeting in Tijuana´s Presidential palace, being present at that
meeting, the Tijuana Major Hector Osuna (Now Senator) and all of the Tijuana public notaries, one of them, argued that the May 7, 1917 decree was not
legitimate, because it was not issued by an elected President; remembering that Venustiano Carranza was named, not elected and under that light, all
of the Venustiano Carranza´s acts, would be voided also, but then, I counter argued, that if that was the case, then being all of the Venustiano
Carranzas legal acts, voided, then if he was the President that by his act, put in effect the Mexico´s actual constitution, then Mexico would not have
an acting Constitution and no law was in effect in Mexico at that time; being that an absurd, everybody accepted the 1917 decree as legal and in
effect.
This lecture was also issued at the Tijuana´s Commerce Chamber the next year by me, to all of the public officials and Real Estate agents and public
notaries, so nobody can claim not knowing.
posted on 1-31-2011 at 21:26
Wooosh
I would not want to see you in legal trouble.
Concession rights are just that a consession to use the land on the activity you asked permission to do, it does not mean you can forbid anybody else
to cross or to use the land on any other use you are not concessioned to use it, It mean you are the only one allowed to use it that way, it does not
mean any other people can not use it in another way, remember that after all you are in public property.
That mean you can not forbid anybody else to cross or use it in any other way different than the one you have.
It is against the law to fence Federal Zone or forbid anybody else to cross the Federal Zone, it is not like private property, it is Public property
where you are allowed to use it in a certain way only.
So Fence it or forbid anybody to enter it is against Federal law and they will certainly prosecute for it.
I recommend you to just enjoy the Federal zone and forget about that lady and if she break the law, just throw the book at her, but do not allow her
to do it at you.
posted on 2-1-2011 at 07:37
Mexican justice is a little slow and need pushing, but sooner or latter it will fall like a ton of bricks on her head.
The help needed is that when you make a complain, make it with copy to every authority related to the problem and if needed to the ¨Oficina de
atencion a la ciudadania de la Presidencia de la Republica¨ we say, it is not what you say but to who you say it; then every authority you sent copy,
ask the authority for an official report and it is very difficult for them to just accept corruption money.
So Complain legally every time she make a mistake and do it again and again with copy to everybody and soon it will form a paper wave that will wash
her away.
Also do not make mistakes yourself, just trust the legal system and it will work, not easy but will work.
posted on 2-2-2011 at 19:25
Wooosh
I likeyour way of action, but, please make a letter to the person who told you that, saying in wrhting what he promised you and thanking him for doing
it, please send copy to the Semarnap Secretary and to the Mexico´s president
If he does what he promise, he will be a hero, if he doesent he will be in a hot spot
posted on 2-2-2011 at 19:29
Please send your letter to Juan Rafael Elvira Quesada
Secretario de SEMARNAP, and to the same person who told you that, take that letter and make two copies, take it to SEMARNAP and ask them to sign the
copy for both authorities, the guy who told you that and the Secretary copy
posted on 2-2-2011 at 19:32
I forgot the president, but include him also, If they do not want to receive the letter, just go to the mail office and mail it to them
posted on 2-2-2011 at 19:40
What he should do and can do for you
He can make the promised letter, ask the marines commander to deliver it and if the marines find somebody as a squater, they can just take him to
federal custody untill he prove he has a legal right, if he do not do this, he will be just giving you the Mary go arround
Authority has to do what the law order them to do, no other way
posted on 2-3-2011 at 10:19
Now back to our Rosarito Story
The Rosarito history is very important, because, as I just demonstrated, the old titles were all issued against the then prevailing law, mainly the
1863 Benito Juarez law.
Then that mean, that all the land on the Tijuana to Ensenada coastal strip has never came out in a legal way, from the National Land dominium and up
to this day, nobody has ever been able to provide legal proof that those titles were legal and as a consequence, those titles should not be used as
precedent for any property but sadly most of the developers are trying to do just that.
The only legal titles today, are the ones based on National Land titles and as we know, there are very few of those, mainly in the El Morro area,
issued in 1951.
A lot of pressure has been put on authorities to validate those titles, they have used a lot of pseudo arguments, up to the moral owners concept but
as you see, no legal argument has ever been sustained in court that allow anybody to use one of those titles as property precedent.
There is also an argument frequently used, based on legal history ignorance, mainly used by new attorneys: that those titles are valid as long as a
Federal Judge have not issued a ruling specify ruling every specific title void.
That argument is based on the modern concept of declaring a legal act void where Inexistence is not a legal fact, there are absolute voidance or
relative voidance and both require a judge ruling to be effective, but that is true only on modern legal acts (1917 to date), you have to apply the
law existing at the time of the legal act execution and that mean, you have to apply to that 1879 title, the law being applied at that time and at
that time, Inexistence was a legal concept meaning that the legal act affected by Inexistence, has never started to exist, that concept changed in
1917, but at that time, the titles were already affected by Inexistence and never started to exist acodrding to the 27 article of the 1863 law, so, it
is impossible to argue that they exist or caused any legal act, giving ground to any property right.
Then at this point I assume everybody has grounds to know that all those old 1879 titles, were no good for any legal act or give base to any legal
property right.
These are not concepts I just invented, those are concepts issued by the Reforma Agraria office to all public officials, I gave public lectures to all
the public notaries and real estate agents in Tijuana and nobody can argue of not knowing those legal facts, all of them have already being tested in
Federal courts and have never been discredited.
posted on 3-2-2011 at 09:47
Knowledge is not useful if it is hidden, the only way we can avoid making the same mistakes again and again, is by knowing the place´s history and how
we solved those same problems in the past.
I am very confident that with Engineer Chavira knowledge, the beach problem will be solved soon and fairly, I know he has several high cards up his
sleeve, just in case.
I sent the investigation we did on San Felipe to the guys with the problem there, but that is just a case where the authorities are the ones to blame,
together with the developers, who build without the needed permits.
In San Felipe the problem is a conflict between the environmental authorities who want to preserve that area development free and the crooked Estate
authorities who allow the development and then are unable to grant the development permits while the developers being over confident on their
influence on the crooked Estate officials, develop the land and then are unable to give the buyers their clear title.
All this is a clear criminal case named ¨Fraude Equiparado¨ committed by the developers against the buyers; a crime that the Estate District attorney
must prosecute, but a crime they do not want to prosecute. There is the problem.
Advise.- Hit the Estate District attorney with everything you can, until he solve the problem via prosecuting the developers or obtaining the legal
permits and granting the clear titles.
posted on 3-2-2011 at 10:03
Elinvestig8r
Thank you for your comments.
Buying property in Baja is something that American people need and will do more and more in the near future.
I believe that they can do it safely if they are armed with the right knowledge that allow them to avoid becoming the usual victim to public officials
and crooked developers and I agree at this point, it is almost a sport to do that in Baja.
Just remember that when something is difficult, the ones armed with the knowledge to do it, have an advantage.
That is the case on Baja, if you know what you are doing, you can buy property safely and without future problems and when most of the buyers become
smart buyers, the crooks will have to become honest people or go out of business.
posted on 3-2-2011 at 21:34
Wooosh
My benefit is a second hand benefit, I have land in Baja and most of it, is undeveloped because there are no investors around, to develop them and
that is happening, because of the bad developers who want to save pennies, while charging prices like USD$3500 dlls/m2 built, to retiring Americans. I
do not mind to do a good business, but you need to respect the customer, if you are planning to stay in business for a long time and I just saw most
of Baja commit economical s
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ramuma53
Banned
Posts: 793
Registered: 2-27-2003
Location: Mulege B.C.S. Mexico
Member Is Offline
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Baja Times and Ecos belong to Hugo Torres and are his personal way to stablish his narcicist image and hide every dark business he gets involved in,
mainly his efforts to obtain by all means property of all the land in Rosarito.
Reality is that, 60% of the land problems in Rosarito Beach are related to him and his associates or family, the other 40% to people he promote and
protect.
Actually, I consider that he is the main Rosarito problem together with the Ejido Mazatlan.
They are the real cause that Rosarito is not a first world town like Los Cabos, or just explain to me, why a beach front city, 20 miles south of the
border with the Richest Estate, that belong to the richest nation in the world, is still a third world town, while Cabo San Lucas 1000 miles south is
a tourist boom.
You want the cause? Hugo Torres Chavert and Ejido Mazatlan are the factors that have kept Rosarito down thorough political influence and
ilegality while taking advantage from the tourist.
I also blame the Rosarito´s whealty people, that have cogregated arround those two entities and condone every illegal act.
[Edited on 4-23-2011 by ramuma53]
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Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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http://www.rosaritoenlanoticia.info/2011/04/actuara-el-minis...
Ramama53- Some familiar family names (from this thread) in this Rancho Del Mangle Real Estate battle in Rosarito Beach. Looks like the local courts
made a decision this week in a messed up land sale from 2010. What's the story on this?
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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