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Arthur
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I agree about Noche Buena. Mmmm-mmm.
But -- just in case someone gets confused -- scurvy didn't have anything to do with rotten food. It's caused by lack of Vitamin C.
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Steve in Oro Valley
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OK OSO:
Why is it EL GATO PANTERA? Should it not be El Gato Pantero? Actually I know the reason.
Steve in Oro Valley
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Braulio
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No way I'm going to bet you about beer, guns, or pickups Oso - besides - I already owe you - (thanks for the book man).
Actually you could have got me for like 1 1/2 out of 2 - Modelo Negra is an ale not a beer - gender happens to be the same but as long as we're being
culeros......
I'm not familiar with Le?n Negra beer - but I've mostly heard the Negra(o)associated with it used in the the feminine - maybe that's because I hang
around a lower class than you. Or maybe not ....
Any way wey - the bet's off - but I'd still like to see your hand.
Culero pomposo K soy.
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Oso
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Well, here we get into the fascinating area of exceptions. Every rule has them and as Braulio's link points out, the gender of nouns in Spanish does
not rely on their biological sex or lack thereof.
While there are gatas and gatos there are no panteros, only panteras both macho (male) and hembra (female).
For that matter, as much as Braulio may have been wishing that Tara Banks would join him at his table (en tus sue?os, wey), there is no such word as
modela. So I should have said one wrong and one half right. The name Cerveceria Modelo literally means "Model (as in exemplary) Brewery". The name
of the beer is Negra Modelo, not Modelo Negra or Modelo Negro or Modela Negra or Negro Modelo. "Modelo" modifies "Negra", not the other way around.
So the name could be translated as the model dark one (dark beer) or the dark one by Modelo (the brewery). The reason I'm using dark instead of
black is because in English we say dark beer, not black beer. In Spanish it doesn't make any difference.
Remember, it's la mano, el mapa etc. Don't rely on the a or o ending.
The end of this thread ought to be cut off and moved to the Spanish forum and Pablo's last post there moved here.
BTW, there is a very good movie called "The Ballad of Gregorio Cortez" based on an incident in New Mexico when an incompetent interpreter caused a
small war and the deaths of several people because of his ignorance of the word "caballo". A herd of horses both male and female can be called
caballos in plural. But one "caballo" is always male (even a gelding). There is no such word as "caballa". If you want to specify a female horse,
the word is "llegua" (mare).
[Edited on 6-7-2005 by Oso]
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Braulio
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I thought you were smarter than that Oso - we're talking about beer and you want to drag the DRAE* into the argument.
I just ran a google @ google.com.mx - I got 252 hits on "Leon Negra" with cerveza - and I got like 10 (actually I forgot - but it's low) on "Leon
Negro" with cerveza. Virually all of the "Le?n Negro" hits refered to things other than the beer we're talking about ( like the country - or
restaurants named the Blcak Lion and such).
It'd seem that most of Mexico is confused about how to order one of it's beers - are you like related to JR or something?
*BTW - The DRAE = a dictionary published by a group of old kooks in a dark room in Spain.
And as far as Tara Banks goes - you're wrong again - we're actaully pretty tight - I'm just not at liberty here to explain.
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Braulio
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Again - Lecho - Oso is refering to something out of the DRAE - not the way people in Mexico speak the language.
Anyone who has watched television in Mexico would know that the usage I used (vis-a-vis modela) is comon usage in Mexico.
And ?guila is spelled with a q - sometimes - by some mexicans.
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Oso
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Yeah, right...
Anyway, the bet may have ended in a draw. It appears that the Le?n Negro of my youthful Carribean days, in the short dark glass bottle with the
stylized Black Lion logo, no longer exists.
It seems to have been bought out by Modelo and the bottle, label and name changed. It's still a dark Munich style beer, but now it's just plain
"Leon", prefaced by "Cerveza Negra".
http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/marcas/leon.html
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Oso
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"Wey" is Braulio's spelling.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Braulio
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If your idea of a draw is when you lose on all counts then yeah - it's a draw wey.
Damn - I wish we could get folks like ferna and Jesse to participate more in stuff like this - anything WE say is kind of like qualified in some way -
it'd be nice to get some horse's mouth's involved here.
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Oso
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"Esposa ejemplar" and "esposa modelo" would be interchangeable.
And yes, Mexico is a full of bad spellers as this board, certainly an excellent reason to follow their example.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Oso
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Braulio
it'd be nice to get some horse's mouth's involved here. |
Yeah, you already got the other end covered.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Braulio
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Sure you want to go there dude?
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Braulio
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And another thought Oso - no - it's not a matter of mexicans being poor spellers - it's the way they speak their language.
In fact that's why the old men in the dark room in Spain have been allowing more Latin American contributions than in the past.
Eventually the definition of modela will be expanded - probably about the time it becomes obsolete.
BTW - Another fact - the majority of the habitantes of the Iberian Peninsula speak spanish as a second language - that's why the whole idea of the
Academy makes so much sense.
[Edited on 6-7-2005 by Braulio]
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Oso
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http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/marcas/negramodelo.html
Yes, modelo can be either adjective or noun. A "modelo modelo" would be a model model i.e.; an exemplary model.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Braulio
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So - Bernie - did you get enough bang for your buck on your topic?
It's been fun.
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Oso
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I have no defense for the DRAE or the Frog equivalent, they're silly old pedos fighting a losing battle. But "modela" is not yet in any dictionary
and I disagree that it's common usage yet. I think you're just hearing it wrong.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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Braulio
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Grammar - even at high levels - is flexible - in the end about anytime you can make a reasonable argument for something you're entitled to stand your
ground.
For example in Esposa modelo it'd be necessary to carry the feminine form of the adjective in order to avoid ambiguity.
(yeah - i know - Esposa isn't the adjecvital form - but it is - because it was just used that way)
At least that's what I would swear to.
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Braulio
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Run a google on modela on google.com.mx. - Or better yet - turn on the tele.
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Oso
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| Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
| Quote: | Originally posted by Oso
"Esposa ejemplar" and "esposa modelo" would be interchangeable. |
How's that work grammatically? There is no listing for modelo as an adjective...
--Larry
[Edited on 6-7-2005 by lencho] |
Yes there is. What dictionary are you looking in? It's actually the first meaning listed in my LaRousse:
modelo adj inv model; es una ni?a modelo she is a model child; empresa modelo model company.
All my childhood I wanted to be older. Now I\'m older and this chitn sucks.
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fdt
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when I first started posting
in the amigos or freds I used ferna de tijuana and everyone thought ferna was a girl, when it's short for fernando. As for esposa modelo, it is
correct to use it, but I'm yet to meet one  , so the word negra referes to the
model that in this case is a beer, that is cerveza, that would be femenine. I have a lot of fun with Mrs. ferna when she starts talking spanish (she
has learned a lot) she thought "no tire basura" meant don't throu tires on the road. And the times that one would use modela is when you are using the
verb modelar (to model), yo modelo, tu modelas el modela etc.
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