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Russ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6742
Registered: 7-4-2004
Location: Punta Chivato
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Santiago, I think if I had a solar system that worked I'd use it until the local power was more reliable. On low solar days they'd have the option to
charge up with local power. But would the local power fry their inverter if it wasn't protected?
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
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Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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Wow, the Faro is literally a "Lighthouse" of information. Thanks for that.
It is really easy to assume that because we have electricity, that it is the same as in the United States but I knew that things were different, just
did not realize fully why that was so. I guess the best solution is to use plug in surge protectors for sensitive things like Microwave ovens, etc.
and not worry too much about the other stuff. I do notice that I have had no problems with my refrigerator which is a Mexican built LG.
And Russ is feeling really good that his solar power is so much cleaner than my "civilized" electricity.
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shari
Select Nomad
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Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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I once asked Juan why there are so many old fridges outside everywhere..some people even use them as fences...it is because of our poor power....burns
out fridges all the time..which is why we only buy used fridges. We suffer from low voltage ALOT which is why I switched to laptops now....just part
of that baja charm!!!!NOT
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ElFaro
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Santiago
El Faro: thanks - what is the price range for these transformers? - $10,000 like Bob said? BOLA recently got electrical service from GN, some 120
miles. The service ends about 2 miles south of town at a group of 20 homes, no large industry/shops prior to it. Does this mean they are faced with
the 'down-hill' problem you've described? I don't recall seeing any transformers other than in town but I will look next time. Is it possible for
them to buy a single transformer prior to the feed to their homes? Since they all had fairly large solar systems, why not use their battery
banks/inverters as the 'transformer'? In other words, simply run their homes off the battery bank like before and use the city power to keep the
batteries charged? |
Check out Hammond...I have bought from them in the past.
www.electricalpowertransformer.com/hammond/autotransformers....
Look under their "Power Conditioning" sub-heading.
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ElFaro
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Sorry...Look under "Power Quality Products" subheading.
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
I once asked Juan why there are so many old fridges outside everywhere..some people even use them as fences...it is because of our poor power....burns
out fridges all the time..which is why we only buy used fridges. We suffer from low voltage ALOT which is why I switched to laptops now....just part
of that baja charm!!!!NOT |
We thought the dimming of the lights was just the spirits creating a little more atmosphere. It also tells us when the water is hot after we turn on
the water heater 
Seriously, I know next to nothing about electricity. Someone mentioned having a surge protector for the refrigerator? Would that help? We also have
a small freezer.
We don't have any electronic items, other than a small radio, but I wonder about my computer.
I was told once that I did not need a surge protector for the lap top when it is plugged in because the battery protected it. Is this correct, or a
falsehood?
Thanks
Diane
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Hook
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Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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While we're clearing up potential falsehoods, can a simple surge protector (like the ones we often plug our desktop computers into) really protect you
from low voltage?
I always thought it had to be a device that either transforms the voltage to an acceptable level and/or it simply cuts power to the circuit when
voltage is above or below a certain threshold.
My operating concept on laptops is that since there is a AC/DC conversion going on in between the wall outlet and the laptop, you could only burn out
the AC/DC converter. But that is pure speculation on my part.
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losfrailes
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Computers and monitors are best protected with an Uninterruptable power supply (UPS) sold at most computer outlets or on ebay.
They will maintain the proper amount of voltage for a few minutes, giving you time to shut your system down.
If you do not protect them, they can be ruined, perhaps laptops go thru a wall wart but most desktops plug directly into the wall outlet.
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by losfrailes
Computers and monitors are best protected with an Uninterruptable power supply (UPS) sold at most computer outlets or on ebay.
They will maintain the proper amount of voltage for a few minutes, giving you time to shut your system down.
If you do not protect them, they can be ruined, perhaps laptops go thru a wall wart but most desktops plug directly into the wall outlet.
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So if I understand what you are saying, even a laptop should be plugged into a UPS???
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Hook
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Laptops HAVE an uninterrupted power supply..........the battery, assuming yours is still in it. It doesnt last forever, but it gives you the power to
protect you from a hard shutdown.
UPS are rather expensive and the batteries need replacing. And if you are running one in low voltage situations, what is that doing to the components
of the UPS?
It's laptops from here on out for me. We dont even use our desktop anymore. But ours is a full sized laptop with a full keyboard and 17 inch HD
monitor. REally heavy sucker.
[Edited on 2-12-2009 by Hook]
[Edited on 2-12-2009 by Hook]
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losfrailes
Senior Nomad
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Location: Ejido San Lucas near Santa Rosalia
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Mood: Good!
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jdtrotter,
Most laptops use a separate power supply which plugs into the wall outlet. I suspect this gives some protection to the computer. The battery only
protects it securely when you are not on street power.
I do not know if the power supply of the laptop gives protection.
My desktop is protected by a UPS, the laptops no. I just do not leave them turned on.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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I have my laptop on most of the time and was told by a reputable repairman that I did not need to be concerned since the power was converted from AC
current to DC current and when the power diminished it just lowered the power going in but the DC Current handles that fluctuation well like your car
electronics continue to operate when the power goes down. I have had the same experience with the power supply to my Hughes Net Modem, my telephone
and answering machine, as well as my printer.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
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Location: Baja California Sur
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
While we're clearing up potential falsehoods, can a simple surge protector (like the ones we often plug our desktop computers into) really protect you
from low voltage? |
I blew up two of the Belkin surge protectors, one was a 6 place plug in with no reset function, the other one was a 6 place plug in with a longer wire
attached and it had a reset function. When it fried, I replaced it with a cheaper version that I had laying around and that night my Pyramid
Regulated Power supply that I use to provide power to VHF radio started sizzling and blew out a diode or something and now I have a terrible buzz in
my VHF radio transmissions.
So, I suspect that some of the surge protectors do work and probably did protect some of the stuff I had plugged in.
The real problem is that you would not want to have your refrigerator or freezer plugged in and then be gone for a week or so, because while it will
protect the surges, it means it will not reset itself and the appliances are not coming back on which makes for a really smelly homecoming.
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BajaNuts
Super Nomad
Posts: 1085
Registered: 5-11-2008
Location: eastern WA, the DRY side
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Mood: no worry, no hurry....it's all good!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Pescador
And Russ is feeling really good that his solar power is so much cleaner than my "civilized" electricity. |
How "clean and green" is Russ's (or any other solar system owner who uses it for the "green" factor) when they have to replace those banks of
batteries every 8-10 years and used up or broken solar panels? Of course, I'm sure they all bring their used solar batteries back to the US so they
can be responsibly recycled and not left around the campo or (God Forbid!) taken to the local dumps..........
sorry don't wanna get off on a tangent here, but green ain't all it's cracked up to be.
Not saying we shouldn't be going that direction.....just that people buy all the solar stuff not realizing what in the stuff they bought and what
they're going to be left with. I just get upset when people claim to be green and then do things like using propane for appliances when the cheapest
hydroelectric power is literally at their front door (I'm talking about our area in the USA, not MX...but the attitude is the same elsewhere)
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Russ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6742
Registered: 7-4-2004
Location: Punta Chivato
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I think Pescador meant I had a good AC supply not "Green".
Pescador, I feel for you!
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9010
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Mood: Inquisitive
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ElFaro
Sorry...Look under "Power Quality Products" subheading. |
What devices under that subheading should we be looking at? Voltage regulators? Line voltage regulators? Super isolation transformers? Mitigating
transformers?
I'd like something that will protect my entire property; RV outlet, garage and house from high/low voltage as well as fluctuations in the power
frequency. Total power draw, IF everything was running at once might be around 80 amps.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9010
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Jim, everything I read on the Belkin site only talks about protection from surges and spikes. Everything related to joules and reaction times. I dont
find anything related to low voltage situations.
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ElFaro
Nomad
Posts: 231
Registered: 9-16-2007
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
What devices under that subheading should we be looking at? Voltage regulators? Line voltage regulators? Super isolation transformers? Mitigating
transformers?
I'd like something that will protect my entire property; RV outlet, garage and house from high/low voltage as well as fluctuations in the power
frequency. Total power draw, IF everything was running at once might be around 80 amps. |
Hook...Santiago...It will most likely will be Voltage Regulators, Line Vltg Regs. or an auto transformer. But I would call them up and explain your
situation / power needs and any issues you are having with local power quality. They are very helpful in suggesting the equipment you would need.
Usually off-the-shelf equipment is sold in kVA steps (e.g. 10, 25, 50, 100) so something just above your calculated needs would probably be in stock.
Hammonds website has some load calculators and formulae to determine your kVA requirements. There is also the issue of what CFE will allow. If your
eq. is down stream of your main ckt. breaker...probably not a problem. If your want it installed on CFE's equipment, obviously you'll need CFE's nod.
Equipment to stabilize frequency ?? - That may get pricey but Hammonds may offer something.
One thing about surge protectors... All they are supposed to do is protect for voltage spikes in the 115 volt range and on equipment limited to 15
amp circuits.
I recommend for all of you in Baja...DO NOT install 220V all electric stoves in your kitchens with electronic controls. Stick to gas stoves with
manual controls. Reason ? ... you can't but surge protection for 220V 30 Amp electric stoves off-the-shelf. Anything available is very expensive.
Living in the back country of San Diego I have 1st hand experience. One night during a storm lightning struck a nearby power pole and sent a voltage
spike through the distribution circuit I'm on. Grounding wires on the poles in the area took care of any stray currents but the voltage spike damaged
the main chip on the electronic control board in my all electric stove. After diagnostics it was determined I needed to replace the main chip but
because it was hard soldered onto the board I had to replace the whole board for $200...about 1/2 the price of the stove itself. So now when there is
a storm with lightning I just throw open the stove circuit breaker in the main panel until the storm passes.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaNuts
| Quote: | Originally posted by Pescador
And Russ is feeling really good that his solar power is so much cleaner than my "civilized" electricity. |
How "clean and green" is Russ's (or any other solar system owner who uses it for the "green" factor) when they have to replace those banks of
batteries every 8-10 years and used up or broken solar panels? Of course, I'm sure they all bring their used solar batteries back to the US so they
can be responsibly recycled and not left around the campo or (God Forbid!) taken to the local dumps..........
sorry don't wanna get off on a tangent here, but green ain't all it's cracked up to be.
Not saying we shouldn't be going that direction.....just that people buy all the solar stuff not realizing what in the stuff they bought and what
they're going to be left with. I just get upset when people claim to be green and then do things like using propane for appliances when the cheapest
hydroelectric power is literally at their front door (I'm talking about our area in the USA, not MX...but the attitude is the same elsewhere)
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Geez, relax, that was kind of an inside joke with my friend Russ who lives at Punta Chivato where they have no electrical power and all the homes are
built either with generators or solar. Russ is well grounded and not some politically correct whacko environmentalist eating granola bars and hugging
cactus all day.
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Santiago
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3512
Registered: 8-27-2003
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Well, if Russ is well grounded, then he should stick with the 12 volt stuff.
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