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woody with a view
PITA Nomad
Posts: 15939
Registered: 11-8-2004
Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
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Mood: Everchangin'
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not for nothing...
suppose Bia and I are out fishing and i catch the first two fish of the day, which happen to be dorado. does that mean i'm done fishing? or can i
continue to fish until the "limit" for the boat is accomplished?
if i'm allowed to continue, and while Bia has eventually caught 5 YFT and 4 yellowtail while i'm skunked the rest of the day, what if a third dorado
bites my/her line? does the Capitain cut my line before the fish gets to gaff, or does the Capitain try to grab and retrieve my lure whilst letting
the fish swim away?
inquiring minds......
[Edited on 10-26-2009 by woody in ob]
[Edited on 10-26-2009 by woody in ob]
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TheColoradoDude
Nomad
Posts: 287
Registered: 2-10-2009
Location: Colorado/San Carlos, Sonora
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Mood: Paz, Amor, y Tacos de Pescado
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If your fishing in the States, do you keep fishing after you have caught your limit? I know that I never troll 3 rods then I only have a license for
2. But I do understand there is quite a bit of a cultural difference between people who sport fish and those who need to feed their families. I can
respect both.
[Edited on 10-26-2009 by TheColoradoDude]
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BajaDanD
Senior Nomad
Posts: 745
Registered: 8-30-2003
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I dont even like Dorado or Marlin that much. I will most likely let them all go. Fun to catch though.
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flyfishinPam
Super Nomad
Posts: 1727
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Loreto, BCS
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Mood: gone fishin'
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Santiago
How many folks need to be on the boat for a catch of 40 tuna and 12 yellowtail?
I think 8: 10 total w/ no more than 5 of any one species? Right? (I know that billfish and dorado count as more than one depending on the fish.)
Is it 'OK' to count the captain and deck hand in the total? By 'OK', I mean legal. Whether or not it's the right thing to do I'll leave alone.
Do the sportfishing limits apply to Mexican citizens also?
I'm not being picky, just curious. |
i'll bite
40 tuna would require 8 anglers
yet 8 could make this catch legally if
two of those 8 anglers caught five YT in addition to their 5 tuna
and one angler caught two YT and five tuna
or
if some or all of the 8 anglers who had boated five tuna also caught a maximum of five YT
8 anglers minimum
yes sportfishing laws apply to Mexican citizens
when going over these limits or selling catch a commercial permit is needed
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flyfishinPam
Super Nomad
Posts: 1727
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Loreto, BCS
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Mood: gone fishin'
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maybe there's some confusion on the limits
I am told we work on a points system and 10 points is your limit
but you cannot take more than five of any one species towards that daily limit
and you can't take more than one billfish or shark
so the points go this way
each species is worth a point with the following exceptions
billfish and sharks = 5
two dorado = 5
two roosterfish = 5
other exceptions mentioned in the rule don't apply to or fishery so they won't be listed here
no limit to how many fish are caught and released (we tried to limit this within the park but were told we couldn't so that as the Mexican laws aren't
that flexible)
now could you boat five yellowtail, four pargo and a dorado?
yes if you are prepared to give it to the official checking you 
actually you'd probably get away with it because chances are they don't realize the dorado is 2.5 points
its always up to interpretation which makes it kinda fun
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Pam, "Kinda fun" makes it sound lighthearted to you and your clients. I can assure you it is as serious as a cardiac infarction to your competitors
and the people on their boats. They might remember that and you'll get all the jolly, drunk ones.
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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they should use these as those grade 4 long math problems
thanks for the clarification Pam...I thought is was each dorado was worth 5 points...good news for todays anglers then.
Can you please show me in the regs where it says the captain/deckhand cant fish if they have a sport license? gracias
now about that 2.5 dorado....I guess the ones that the sealions eat half of would count as a .5!!!
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flyfishinPam
Super Nomad
Posts: 1727
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Loreto, BCS
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Mood: gone fishin'
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
Pam, "Kinda fun" makes it sound lighthearted to you and your clients. I can assure you it is as serious as a cardiac infarction to your competitors
and the people on their boats. They might remember that and you'll get all the jolly, drunk ones. |
you don't find the way things are kinda fun? if I were as serious as a heart attack in any of this I wouldda had one a long time ago. don't sweat
the small stuff. if you or anyone think the way I do things is illegal check us anytime our internal policies are stricter than the fisheries laws
but that is by choice. and thank goodness no drunkos we stopped getting them a long time ago when we changed our rate structure. we're serious about
what we do but we have fun in the process. salud.
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flyfishinPam
Super Nomad
Posts: 1727
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Loreto, BCS
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Mood: gone fishin'
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
....Can you please show me in the regs where it says the captain/deckhand cant fish if they have a sport license? gracias
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no I can't because there isn't such a reg. if the captain and crew posess licenses then their limit can count towards the boat limit too. the boat
limit would be the combined total of fish counting towards each angler onboard with a permit. technically they all must catch their own fish but how
the hell can anyone checking the limits know this unless they saw the fish caught? if the crew is cool with giving their catch up to their clients
its their business. usually in our case its the clients that end up giving it all to the captain as most of ours don't take back fish.
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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gracias hermana....boy do I look forward to the day we have more clients like yours!! It is INCREDIBLE the amount of fish guys have taken back.
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4baja
Super Nomad
Posts: 1339
Registered: 9-4-2003
Location: morro bay ca
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the two guys pictured in russes post were actualy part of a larger group that wasnt in the picture. they were probably legal.
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bajabass
Super Nomad
Posts: 2016
Registered: 10-4-2006
Location: La Paz,BCS
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Mood: Want to fish!!!
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Thanks for clearing this up. A similar thread on BD had me confused. I read it as 2 dorado =5 fish. Everyone was saying 1=5. Hey, 5 tuna and 2 dorado
and I eat like a king for a couple weeks! Here in La Mision I usually release all but 2 or 3 fish. I prefer fresh, and I fish often enough I don't
freeze it. I love it when the lings are still flipping in the cooler a half hour before they go on the grill!!!
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bill erhardt
Super Nomad
Posts: 1372
Registered: 4-2-2005
Location: Loreto, BCS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
bill....I dont see how you can keep more than one dorado and one rooster...each of those fish count for 5 fish each so with 2 dorado...or a dorado and
1 roosterfish...that adds up to 10 fish so you are done. You are ALLOWED 2 dorado but they would add up to 10 fish. If our clients want to keep a
dorado, then they can only get 5 more fish...tuna or yellowtail, calico etc.
here are the regulations.... |
Shari......I did not intentionally ignore you, but was fishing yesterday and the day before outside Mag Bay (3 hoos Monday, none yesterday) And, when
I got back to the dock in Lopez Mateos yesterday afternoon after two days out, I was checked for license and catch. Enforcement is catching on
everywhere. In my absence it looks like Pam clarified a lot of issues that have caused confusion.
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Pam, now I get it. Very, Very serious fun. I'm just gettin' old.
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comitan
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4177
Registered: 3-27-2004
Location: La Paz
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Mood: mellow
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4baja
You're a nice guy, that photo was taken at Ensenada Muertos, and I have spent many an afternoon watching the Pangas bringing in the fisherman with so
may fish over the limit and many tiny dorado. Hopefully they Mexicans will start taking care of their fisheries.
Strive For The Ideal, But Deal With What\'s Real.
Every day is a new day, better than the day before.(from some song)
Lord, Keep your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth.
“The sincere pursuit of truth requires you to entertain the possibility that everything you believe to be true may in fact be false”
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shari
Select Nomad
Posts: 13048
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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thanks Bill and gracias for the on site report of how things are getting legal here so be prepared amigos...spread the word and the transition will go
more smoothly once everyone understands how things are going to work....great fishing nonetheless...till today's blow.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Santiago
uh oh, I may have goofed. The post on BD I was referring to has been changed: they caught 40 tuna and 12 yellowtail but only kept 6. I stand
corrected, if not somewhat incredulous..... |
No problem. I was camped next to a guy and his buddy at BOLA who were bringing in 30 yellowtail a day off Smith Island. He kept it up until all of his
coolers were full.
To him the 'limit' was the limit of the icebox.
He'd been doing it for years. I don't think he was the exception.
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Santiago
uh oh, I may have goofed. The post on BD I was referring to has been changed: they caught 40 tuna and 12 yellowtail but only kept 6. I stand
corrected, if not somewhat incredulous..... |
And that post on BD could win an award for one of the fastest edited clean-up jobs---looks like they used a snow plow to move the snow in. 
[Edited on 10-28-2009 by DianaT]
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woody with a view
PITA Nomad
Posts: 15939
Registered: 11-8-2004
Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
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Mood: Everchangin'
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if i can survive tomorrow, we're coming down friday. leaving OB around 3am. quick stop in El Ros to see friends and we'll be at the Campo Sirena by
2pm, i'm guessing. save me a good spot!!!!
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1856
Registered: 3-9-2009
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Using Shari's post of the rules as gospel, then 2 Dorado caught by one licensed fisherman = 10 fish (or 10 points) and that fisherman has limited out
for the day. 2 Dorado does not equal 5 fish.
The confusion comes from ambiguously written language in the regulations:
"In ocean waters and estuaries the limit is a total of ten fish per day, with no more than 5 catches of a single specie, except of the species of
Marlin, Sailfish, Swordfish and Shark, of which only one specimen of either is allowed, and which counts a five toward the overall 10 fish limit, or
Dorado, Roosterfish, Shad, or Tarpon, of which only two samples of each specie are allowed, and which count a five toward the overall 10 fish
limit.***"
The ambiguity relates to the following part of the above paragraph "... "or Dorado, Roosterfish, Shad, or Tarpon, of which only two samples of each
specie are allowed, and which count a five toward the overall 10 fish limit.***" The prepositional phrase "which count a five toward the overall 10
fish limit" describes and is the antecedent to "Dorado, Roosterfish, Shad or Tarpon" and not to the other prepositional phrase "which count a five
toward the overall 10 fish limit.***"
The above argument is supported by the verbiage of the regulation that follows the above cited paragraph, in pertinent part, "if you catch 1 marlin (5
points) and 1 dorado (5 points), you have reached your limit for the day or 2 dorado; 1 dorado plus 5 miscellaneous species; or, 1 roosterfish plus 1
dorado."
It is common practice to rectify ambiguity by using references within the given document that serve to further clarify. An ambiguous phrase with no
further clarifying phrases should stand as an ambiguity thus allowing for more than one interpretation, but when further verbiage is available, then
the ambiguity is eliminated and only one interpretation should (and customarily will) hold validity.
All this is kind of tedious, but, ambiguity has always been my pet peeve.
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