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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
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| Quote: | Originally posted by soulpatch
With all that is being stated here are any of you aware of Ron and his wife having advanced directives in place?
His daughter may have her hands tied if there is.
Also, to cast stones at a daughter for taking care of her child? Really? Do you walk in her shoes?
And, really, is the VA a huge step up? Not in San Diego county, that's for damn sure.
There are a lot of issues at play here and it is not the family's responsibility to monitor this site, as much as we would all love that.
Hopefully the induced coma and ventilation are doing what they are supposed to be doing and the TX for his wife is effective, as well.
Health care is, after all, a personal and family responsibility.
It is my hope that Ron and his wife make a full recovery soon.
Having had may dialogs with Ron I think he had most eventualities pretty buttoned down.
I hope so for his sake. |
So very well written--
We continue to pray for a full recovery for both of them and we do hope that everyone will support the family in whatever financial and or emotional
way available,
AND respect the family in their decisions and understand that it is different for everyone and every family. If they choose to communicate here, OK,
and if not, that is also OK----very much OK.
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Ken Cooke
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8946
Registered: 2-9-2004
Location: Riverside, CA
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Mood: Pole Line Road postponed due to injury
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
A neighbor of mine was in a private hospital for 3 days here in Tijuana and it was 10,000 dollars. |
Fernando,
You are doing a great job -- Don't get frustrated, and see you in January at Dia de los Reyes! 
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AmoPescar
Senior Nomad
Posts: 835
Registered: 7-15-2006
Location: North San Diego County
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Mood: Need a Fish Taco and a Pacifico!
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Fernando / Jesse...
That same stay in a U.S. hospital would probably be 2 to 4 times that!
In 2006, Mike Humfreville was in an Ensenada hospital for 3 days. His TOTAl bill for the stay...$1200! Doctors, drugs, IV's blood work, everything! In
the U.S. it would have been at least 20 times that amount!
| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
A neighbor of mine was in a private hospital for 3 days here in Tijuana and it was 10,000 dollars. |
Nomad Amigos...Here\'s hoping you all have safe Baja travels, amazing sunrises, sunny days, comforting breezes, beautiful sunsets, tasty tacos,
cold cervezas and frosty margaritas!!
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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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| Quote: | Originally posted by AmoPescar
Fernando / Jesse...
That same stay in a U.S. hospital would probably be 2 to 4 times that!
In 2006, Mike Humfreville was in an Ensenada hospital for 3 days. His TOTAl bill for the stay...$1200! Doctors, drugs, IV's blood work, everything! In
the U.S. it would have been at least 20 times that amount!
| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
A neighbor of mine was in a private hospital for 3 days here in Tijuana and it was 10,000 dollars. |
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I went to the emergency room one time i was in Bellingham Washington, i spent about 15 minutes in there, got 4 pills, gotr checked out really quick,
and was charged $375 
I was in shock when i got the bill.
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fdt
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4059
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Tijuana, Baja California
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Mood: Yeah, what if it all goes right
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So, do I go tomorrow?
A well informed Baja California traveler is a smart Baja California traveler!
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AmoPescar
Senior Nomad
Posts: 835
Registered: 7-15-2006
Location: North San Diego County
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Mood: Need a Fish Taco and a Pacifico!
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Ferna,
I think you should! It would be good to see his condition for yourself...and as Shari and some of us have said, HE needs an advocate to be there for
him. If he IS getting better by then, maybe they'll allow visitors for brief periods of time.
I was thinking...It would be interesting to find someone on the street and ask them to walk into Del Carmen and say they were there for their MRI and
"where do I go for it" Then they could walk back out and give you the answer as to whether they actually have one or NOT!!
| Quote: | | So, do I go tomorrow? |
Nomad Amigos...Here\'s hoping you all have safe Baja travels, amazing sunrises, sunny days, comforting breezes, beautiful sunsets, tasty tacos,
cold cervezas and frosty margaritas!!
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AmoPescar
Senior Nomad
Posts: 835
Registered: 7-15-2006
Location: North San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Need a Fish Taco and a Pacifico!
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GOOD NIGHT ALL!
My prayers to Ron, Cristina, their families and wisdom for the doctors!
Michael  
Nomad Amigos...Here\'s hoping you all have safe Baja travels, amazing sunrises, sunny days, comforting breezes, beautiful sunsets, tasty tacos,
cold cervezas and frosty margaritas!!
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
So, do I go tomorrow?
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Absolutely!
Please confirm or deny lizard lips observations once and for all. It would give us a measure of peace.
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oladulce
Super Nomad
Posts: 1625
Registered: 5-30-2005
Location: bcs
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
... According to Christine (daughter) her dad IS doing much better, his swelling in the face has gone down and he has had an MRI.
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Along with his broken jaw and head injury Ron must have a lot of facial swelling. It distorts facial features, looks terrible, and can be very
upsetting for family members to find their loved-one nearly unrecognizable. Anxious, frightened, and unsure of what else to look for to gauge their
patient's condition, facial swelling becomes a focus for friends and family because it's something they can see.
But a swollen face isn't dangerous. A swollen brain is. Hopefully there is no misinterpretation when the doctor reports "the swelling has gone down".
The elusive MRI....
maybe it's a mobile unit, always on the move 
Lots of talk about the "MRI", but remember it's just a tool not a treatment. Nice keepsake images to put in your scrapbook, but the machine
does not treat the injuries that cause bleeding or swelling in your brain.
An MRI is really not the diagnostic tool of choice for head trauma evaluation. A ol' fashioned CT scan remains the gold standard for visualizing the
brain.
If your friend or family member is in the hospital, I always recommend someone stays at their bedside. Doesn't matter what country you're in, if it's
a big Uni hospital, or a little podunk place- stuff happens no matter how good the level of care usually is. You don't have to have medical knowledge,
just being there will improve the quality of their care. If a loved-one was unresponsive, intubated and in a non-US hospital I would not blink for
fear of missing something.
I'm so sorry we are 2 days drive away, but we will gladly pitch in to pay for a round-the-clock private duty nurse or someone to sit at Ron's bedside
so he is not left alone, if someone is able to coordinate that.
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robt65
Newbie
Posts: 5
Registered: 9-12-2011
Location: San Juan del Rio - Queretaro
Member Is Offline
Mood: Let me Check!
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Possible VA Medical Assistance for Ron
- Ron has helped me via posting on another (MexConnect) site in regards to construction of my own home in Queretaro. I never had the pleasure of
meeting Ron personally. I have read with great sadness of Ron & Cristinas misfortune. I have read every thread of all 27 pages regarding this
medical problem.
I have a few questions myself. Being a 90% disabled Navy Veteran living in Mexico and married to a Mexicana, I have some information that may be able
to help . . . . . . or not. Does anyone know for sure if Ron is a "service connected disabled" or if he is a "Retired Navy" Veteran? The VA does have
a "Foreign Medical Program in effect in Mexico. It really is a pretty good program with several good options that could possibly save Ron &
Cristina a bunch of money. Here is the VA site: http://www.va.gov/hac/forbeneficiaries/fmp/fmp.asp
Many Military Vets living in Mexico have no idea of this program. For those of you ready to run and get the information from this post, let me assure
you that it takes a disabled vet who has been under the care of the VA System to begin to understand this program. There is a phone number listed on
this VA site and I would suggest that Ron's close friends or "SiReNiTa" or "fdt" get this information to Ron's family for further consideration.
"SiReNiTa" or "fdt" or “oladulce” or "Morgaine7" and some others have very valid points. Losing one's head at times such as this for whatever reason
only complicates matters. That sure isn't needed at times like these. Ron, I am sure will be reading these threads in the future as Morgaine7 has
said. The last thing needed now is a bunch of we expats going off the deep end and hijacking Ron from a Mexican hospital.
Seems to me that "SiReNiTa" or "fdt" or “oladulce” are good contacts for now. Ron's daughter sure doesn't need any additional stress at this time.
None of us knows her situation at this point, and I am sure it is none of our business what his personal relationship is or is not with his daughter.
Push comes to shove, she is still his blood and I am sure (at times such as these) his daughter will do all she can for her father. If not she would
not have come on a moment’s notice in the first place. What do any of us know of her circumstances? Nada!
"Just saying".
The VA has one of the very best medical centers in La Jolla just a short drive North of the border. How do I know this . . . . . . . I was there for
some serious medical care. It is staffed by some of the very best doctors from the University of California, La Jolla part and parcel of the VA La
Jolla Medical Center complex. retired or not, Service Connected or not, The VA will care for him there at no cost to him if needed. They have a Spinal
Care Injury unit there with some of the very best Neurologists in the world practicing there.
Someone please get this information to Ron's daughter for consideration.
Get well soon Ron & Cristina, you still owe me some answers on my house remodel and addition. (smiling) You're in my prayers.
I apologize if I am not posting this correctly, as I have just joined today and I am not familiar with the way this site works yet.
Anyway . . . . . . . God Speed Ron & Cristina.
robt65
| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
here's the story:
I spoke to Christine, Ron's daughter and she as oposed to what has been stated here has been with her dad and yes, they, her and her husband have gone
back to the states to take care of their child as Sirenita stated and will return on friday. If for any reason Christine was not seen at Ron's bedside
is that this young lady had to go and be also with Cristina, remember Ron's wife. So she was back and forth between hospitals. Did whoever did all
this checking on Mri's or none do the same? I personaly have spoken with Christina and I believe what she is telling me, she sounds like a very
centered young woman who is keeping her cool, way better than some others. s much as I'd like to be in solidarity with Sirenita and just not post on
this subject in order to avoid beeing called one with false information, for Ron and Cristina I will continue monitoring and reporting. There bare
more people involved that are in charge of Ron and Cristina. According to Christine (daughter) her dad IS doing much better, his swelling in the face
has gone down and he has had an MRI. She, even thou not physicaly in Ensenada will be in constant contact with the doctor in charge of Ron and
viceversa. If Ron does get released in three days there is someone there looking after him and will take care of him and the transport. As for
Cristina's condition, it is also much better, she was drinking water already.
Now as for the moneys; The $5,000 dollars is the total estimate. Christine spent $10,000 pesos yesterday, $20,000 pesos today at the hospital and
$7,000 for lab expenses (maybe the alleged MRI?) and yes, part of that was paid with a debit card. The balance is about $25,000 pesos, so all in all
there you have the roughly $5,000 dollars.
It could be more so that is why this young woman and her husband went back to the US, to see if Ron had some funds available that they could get to
pay for all this mess.
I recomend strongly that instead of putting someone down or critisizing for helping as much as posible, you should aplaud them for making the right
decisions for the best interest of her dad and Cristina. They DID NOT JUST LEAVE, they left someone in charge!
Now Christine is aware of the monetary offers made here BUT NO, NO ONE IS MONITORING THIS THREAD TO HIKE UP THE BILL! She is aware of it because I
told her! So now what, it aparently won't be for a transfer but to pay the hospital. If you all want, I can go as soon as mañana.
We were doing just fine in the afternoon with the good news that they are both getting better. What went wrong? Why can't it be possible? Why must
they be the same or worse? |
[Edited on 9-13-2011 by robt65]
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ELINVESTIG8R
Select Nomad
Posts: 15882
Registered: 11-20-2007
Location: Southern California
Member Is Offline
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I will call the VA Hospital in San Diego this morning to see if they will admit Ron as a
U.S. Navy Veteran without his DD-214.
Is Ron conscious/alert enough to write down or say where his DD-214 is located so his daughter or someone can get it if the VA Hospital says they need
that document first?
The DD-214 is a document that proves Ron was in the U.S. Navy. He will also need some government identification i.e. Driver’s License, etc.
EDIT TO ADD: Whoever gets the above information, can you also get his Social Security Number so if the VA wants to check to see if he is a registered
veteran they can check with that.
[Edited on 9-13-2011 by ELINVESTIG8R]
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BajaNomad
Super Administrator
Posts: 4999
Registered: 8-1-2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: INTP-A
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Can someone contact me via privately via u2u with contact info (tel#) for Reyes in San Quintin?
Thank you.
Edit to add: I've got a handful of #'s for him, but would appreciate it I can confirm one of these as being the best # for him. Thank you.
[Edited on 9-13-2011 by BajaNomad]
When I was young, I admired clever people. Now that I am old, I admire kind people.
– Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel
We know we must go back if we live, and we don`t know why.
– John Steinbeck, Log from the Sea of Cortez
https://www.regionalinternet.com
Affordable Domain Name Registration/Management & cPanel Web Hosting - since 1999 |
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Mexitron
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3397
Registered: 9-21-2003
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
this whole nightmare has inspired me to really get cracking to organize our group of friends here to make up an emergency plan complete with everyones
info like family contact numbers, meds, allergies, blood types, health issues, insurance plans, notarized list of possible people to make decisions in
the absence of family, person's personal wishes for treatment/burial...stuff like that so that in the event of a catastrophy, we could resond quicker
and more efficiently...less confusion....alot to think about here and lots of good lessons learned...nighty night all and thanks again...keep those
prayers and energy flowing. |
Sounds like a good plan Shari (you could probably even write a book about it)
[Edited on 9-13-2011 by Mexitron]
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angels4
Nomad
Posts: 124
Registered: 9-12-2011
Member Is Offline
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Baja Nomad- Someone will contact you with Reyes info. Best regards.
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ELINVESTIG8R
Select Nomad
Posts: 15882
Registered: 11-20-2007
Location: Southern California
Member Is Offline
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If the San Diego VA Hospital says they will accept Ron and Ron’s daughter says it’s ok to
transfer Ron can someone in Ensenada open a bank account in Ensenada so those who pledged money can deposit money from our bank accounts so it can be
withdrawn to get Ron out of the Ensenada hospital?
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mtgoat666
Select Nomad
Posts: 18377
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline
Mood: Hot n spicy
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
If the San Diego VA Hospital says they will accept Ron and Ron’s daughter says it’s ok to
transfer Ron can someone in Ensenada open a bank account in Ensenada so those who pledged money can deposit money from our bank accounts so it can be
withdrawn to get Ron out of the Ensenada hospital? |
why do you think money is the issue? for all we know he may have insurance in USA or sufficient money of his own.
the issue appears to be that daughter has medical power of attorney and daughter thinks he is fine where he is.
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SFandH
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7084
Registered: 8-5-2011
Member Is Offline
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Wouldn't his wife be the decision maker if she is physically capable? I understand she was injured, one or more bad cuts, but maybe she's fully
conscious and on the mend. Anybody know about her condition?
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baronvonbob
Nomad
Posts: 196
Registered: 1-5-2010
Member Is Offline
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The VA program for this is for treatment of the existing Service Connected Disability, not new.
| Quote: | Originally posted by robt65
- Ron has helped me via posting on another (MexConnect) site in regards to construction of my own home in Queretaro. I never had the pleasure of
meeting Ron personally. I have read with great sadness of Ron & Cristinas misfortune. I have read every thread of all 27 pages regarding this
medical problem.
I have a few questions myself. Being a 90% disabled Navy Veteran living in Mexico and married to a Mexicana, I have some information that may be able
to help . . . . . . or not. Does anyone know for sure if Ron is a "service connected disabled" or if he is a "Retired Navy" Veteran? The VA does have
a "Foreign Medical Program in effect in Mexico. It really is a pretty good program with several good options that could possibly save Ron &
Cristina a bunch of money. Here is the VA site: http://www.va.gov/hac/forbeneficiaries/fmp/fmp.asp
Many Military Vets living in Mexico have no idea of this program. For those of you ready to run and get the information from this post, let me assure
you that it takes a disabled vet who has been under the care of the VA System to begin to understand this program. There is a phone number listed on
this VA site and I would suggest that Ron's close friends or "SiReNiTa" or "fdt" get this information to Ron's family for further consideration.
"SiReNiTa" or "fdt" or “oladulce” or "Morgaine7" and some others have very valid points. Losing one's head at times such as this for whatever reason
only complicates matters. That sure isn't needed at times like these. Ron, I am sure will be reading these threads in the future as Morgaine7 has
said. The last thing needed now is a bunch of we expats going off the deep end and hijacking Ron from a Mexican hospital.
Seems to me that "SiReNiTa" or "fdt" or “oladulce” are good contacts for now. Ron's daughter sure doesn't need any additional stress at this time.
None of us knows her situation at this point, and I am sure it is none of our business what his personal relationship is or is not with his daughter.
Push comes to shove, she is still his blood and I am sure (at times such as these) his daughter will do all she can for her father. If not she would
not have come on a moment’s notice in the first place. What do any of us know of her circumstances? Nada!
"Just saying".
The VA has one of the very best medical centers in La Jolla just a short drive North of the border. How do I know this . . . . . . . I was there for
some serious medical care. It is staffed by some of the very best doctors from the University of California, La Jolla part and parcel of the VA La
Jolla Medical Center complex. retired or not, Service Connected or not, The VA will care for him there at no cost to him if needed. They have a Spinal
Care Injury unit there with some of the very best Neurologists in the world practicing there.
Someone please get this information to Ron's daughter for consideration.
Get well soon Ron & Cristina, you still owe me some answers on my house remodel and addition. (smiling) You're in my prayers.
I apologize if I am not posting this correctly, as I have just joined today and I am not familiar with the way this site works yet.
Anyway . . . . . . . God Speed Ron & Cristina.
robt65
| Quote: | Originally posted by fdt
here's the story:
I spoke to Christine, Ron's daughter and she as oposed to what has been stated here has been with her dad and yes, they, her and her husband have gone
back to the states to take care of their child as Sirenita stated and will return on friday. If for any reason Christine was not seen at Ron's bedside
is that this young lady had to go and be also with Cristina, remember Ron's wife. So she was back and forth between hospitals. Did whoever did all
this checking on Mri's or none do the same? I personaly have spoken with Christina and I believe what she is telling me, she sounds like a very
centered young woman who is keeping her cool, way better than some others. s much as I'd like to be in solidarity with Sirenita and just not post on
this subject in order to avoid beeing called one with false information, for Ron and Cristina I will continue monitoring and reporting. There bare
more people involved that are in charge of Ron and Cristina. According to Christine (daughter) her dad IS doing much better, his swelling in the face
has gone down and he has had an MRI. She, even thou not physicaly in Ensenada will be in constant contact with the doctor in charge of Ron and
viceversa. If Ron does get released in three days there is someone there looking after him and will take care of him and the transport. As for
Cristina's condition, it is also much better, she was drinking water already.
Now as for the moneys; The $5,000 dollars is the total estimate. Christine spent $10,000 pesos yesterday, $20,000 pesos today at the hospital and
$7,000 for lab expenses (maybe the alleged MRI?) and yes, part of that was paid with a debit card. The balance is about $25,000 pesos, so all in all
there you have the roughly $5,000 dollars.
It could be more so that is why this young woman and her husband went back to the US, to see if Ron had some funds available that they could get to
pay for all this mess.
I recomend strongly that instead of putting someone down or critisizing for helping as much as posible, you should aplaud them for making the right
decisions for the best interest of her dad and Cristina. They DID NOT JUST LEAVE, they left someone in charge!
Now Christine is aware of the monetary offers made here BUT NO, NO ONE IS MONITORING THIS THREAD TO HIKE UP THE BILL! She is aware of it because I
told her! So now what, it aparently won't be for a transfer but to pay the hospital. If you all want, I can go as soon as mañana.
We were doing just fine in the afternoon with the good news that they are both getting better. What went wrong? Why can't it be possible? Why must
they be the same or worse? |
[Edited on 9-13-2011 by robt65] |
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
Member Is Offline
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Shari, we keep all that stuff in a computer folder and my wife and I both have flash cards on our keychains with that stuff updated. Hope is that
wherever one could find medical attention there would probably be computers close by to pull it up, use it, copy it, email it, etc. etc. Just a
thought.
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
Member Is Offline
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I have been following this thread. This is a tragic situation, one that generates strong feelings of compassion, confusion, fear and anger, all
reflected in the body of this thread.
Medical care is a complex issue and when you add cultural differences to the mix you have a real ball of yarn. Of similar complexity is understanding
the medical resources available to people, including Xpats, in Mexico. The myriad levels of immigration status also complicate the picture. Issues of
medical insurance, both foreign and domestic are another set of issues. Powers of attorney for medical and financial care are also significant issues.
Nomads are a wonderful source of compassion and support as one can easily see from this thread. We should all be grateful that we have this collective
resource available to us. I know I am.
It is very difficult in a situation like this to get a clear picture of what is really going on. This is why having a medical advocate is so
important. Wonderful, generous people on this site have been jumping into the breach to try to provide this support. It is however difficult to do
this without having access to the whole picture. This is why it is so important to have someone at our side, who knows us and our wishes, when we are
in the hospital. Aside from the emotional support this presence offers they act as an outside set of eyes and ears for the us when we are in that bed.
There are reasons for consent forms, rules about who has access to medical information and who has the legal right to make medical decisions for the
patient. You would not want someone making life/death/economic decisions for you that you did not know and trust.
We all enter the medical system as patient, friend, or advocate with different levels of knowledge, awareness and trust of medical personnel. It is a
powerful emotional experience and requires a great deal of thought in an extremely complex and emotionally loaded environment. We all vary in our
capacities to deal with situations like this. It is my belief and experience that most in this situation, with all the knowledge, information,
experience that they have, at the time, try to make the best decisions possible. People in this position may be naive, ignorant, misinformed, and
gullible or emotionally not up to the task. However it is important to recognize that most people are doing the best they can for the people they love
and are doing so in the most extreme situation they may ever experience in their lives. Caution is required in second guessing people who step up to
the plate and who have the legal responsibility to make decisions for those they love who are unable to advocate for themselves.
I have been in discussion with Shari and believe there are object lessons here for all Nomads.
Originally posted by shari
"this whole nightmare has inspired me to really get cracking to organize our group of friends here to make up an emergency plan complete with
everyone’s info like family contact numbers, meds, allergies, blood types, health issues, insurance plans, notarized list of possible people to make
decisions in the absence of family, person's personal wishes for treatment/burial...stuff like that so that in the event of a catastrophe, we could
respond quicker and more efficiently...less confusion....a lot to think about here and lots of good lessons learned....."
I would encourage all Nomads to make sure you:
1. Know the medical system in Mexico. It is complex. Sometimes the most popular hospital is not the best. Sometimes the public is better than the
private and visa versa. Identify a doctor of record for yourself if possible. There is no stronger advocate for you than your own doctor.
2. Write up a clear document that lists all of your vital information for medical purposes i.e. full name, date of birth, place of birth, mother’s
maiden name, social security number, health insurance plan name, your plan number, name and contact information for your medical advocate, copy of
signed medical power of attorney (there is an equivalent in Mexico), names, addresses and phone numbers of family members to contact (be sure to use
proper country and area codes.
3. With the document above list all of your medical conditions, medical history including all prior diagnosis, medical conditions and medications,
include any allergies.
4. Have these documents translated by a person with sufficient language skills to be able to clearly and correctly translate what you have written.
Remember that different people have different levels of knowledge of medical/legal jargon.
5. Make sure there are people who you know and trust that have copies of these documents in both English and Spanish.
6. Explore Mexican private insurance. It is available and can be very reasonably priced. Be sure you have coverage for evacuation if this is needed.
7. Know your resources. Familiarize yourself with the medical resources around you. Know what services are available at your local clinic. Do they
have a defibrillator? Do they have x-ray, CAT, MRI? What sort of problem can they handle? If more care is needed what is the best resource? What is
the best hospital that you can use given your insurance, capacity to cover your expenses? Remember that consumers are only one source of this
information, talk to local Mexican medical insurance agents. See if you can get a Mexican medical insurance policy, maybe set up a group policy.
Having a medical insurance agent in Mexico can be a great source of support in negotiating the system.
This list is not exhaustive and it would at some point be helpful for a bicultural group in your community to clarify the many issues addressed here.
It is important to have a PLAN. Time is of the essence in medical care. Too little too late can be deadly.
My heart goes out to Ron and Christine in the long road they will have in their recovery and re-adjustment to their new circumstances. I extend my
very best wishes to them and their families. Healing will need to happen on many levels and I hope they know from reading this thread that they are
loved and cared for. I send my best wishes for a speedy recovery.
PLAN NOW!
Iflyfish
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