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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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| Quote: | Originally posted by lizard lips
As most of you know I travel all over Mexico and have lived in Baja for many years. Mexico and the states of Baja Sur and Baja Calif. have changed as
far as criminal activity is concerned in places that I never thought it would ever happen. Because of this my way of doing things have changed as
well. There are cities and states that I will not go back to anytime soon such as Tamaulipas, Chihuahua, Coahuila, Michoacan, Guerrero, and Nayarit. I
have worked in all the small ranchos and cities in Mexico along the Texas, Arizona and New Mexico border that will never see my face again. Just to
dangerous. Sinaloa is another however I will be going to Mazatlan in December to work on a murder investigation and I have no problem there in that I
feel pretty safe. I just turned down an assignment in Culiacan last week because it's crime has been just crazy for several years. Last time I was
there was two years ago but that area including Los Mochis and Guasave are very active, as anywhere in Sinaloa, with crime and I'm done in these area
as well. Acapulco, forget about it.
I always believed that Cabo San Lucas was a very safe place to go and immune from criminal activity but what has happened recently with a shooting in
front of a supermarket has me very concerned.
So where is it safer, Mexico or the U.S.? I really don't know but what I can tell you is I would have no problem going to any state in the U.S. for
business or pleasure.
Has elected government officials in cities and states in Mexico seen a decrease in being involved in criminal activity? NO-----Where is a chart or
graft that can explain this? There are none and you don't need a weather man to know which way the wind blows and it has been blowing in the same
direction for 500 years. Why has this changed so suddenly now?
We that live in Baja and mainland Mexico have to take more precautions than we did before, there's no doubt about it. Not only are the cartels
involved but there are groups and individuals that have joined in on kidnappings and have targeted small business owners for extortion and threats of
death if they don't pay for "protection" and yes Jesse, you could say this was happening in the U.S. I would feel more comfortable calling the police
in the U.S. for help than in Mexico when you really don't know if they are involved or bought off.
I really like Baja and living here but times have changed and I am concerned and there are those who see through rose colored glasses and go about
there business as nothing has happened and all is well until it does and affects them in a negative way.
The Nomad board attracts those who despise Mexico and Mexicans and the gringos who live here but we that have made the move know all to well what is
actually occurring good and bad. Lately there hasn't been to much good to report with over 40,000 murders in the last 6 years. It's a fact plain and
simple. Try and overcome the big picture. You can't.
This post is from someone who really cares about the future of Mexico and it's people. I am not being negative, just informative and honest. For those
of you who want to sit there and pick apart this post have at it. It is just the truth as I know it. Enuf said...... |
Nobody disagrees with your view, and i don't think anybody wants to see things tru rose colored glasses, there is an increase in crime and up to a
certain point, its normal, in other areas its not. But this is not the hell hole some want baja to be, this is still a pretty safe place to live.
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mad as hell
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mengano
| Quote: | Originally posted by Iflyfish
Erick Berne, M.D. described a Psychological Game called "Ain't It Awful". This game is played by constantly seeing the negative in everything and
spending time focused upon it. It reinforces the existential position of the protagonist "I'm superior" and that is a cover for deep insecurity and
feelings of low self worth. This game can be played between the "Parents" of two or more people and can become a Pastime, like talking about Baseball
or where I found the cheapest ..... you name it. |
What a great, in-depth internet psychiatric analysis. Do you do a lot of testifying as an expert witness on psychological matters? Of course, if you
are really interested in that, you should also read, "I'm OK, You're OK", by Thomas A Harris MD.
Pointing out that somebody is lying in order to advance his own personal agenda is not a psychological game, nor is it anything that one needs to be
cured of. Altruism is not a mental illness. As Freud may have said, "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar." |
Oh I use to love the 70's Psychobabble. My personal favorite use to be Arthur Janov's "Primal Scream." It works wonders when you let out a loud primal
scream!
However I do think Iflyfish makes a few insightful good points.
And it's nice to see you Mengano and Dennis on the same side again. Dennis use to be a very strong follower of yours, and thought you were often right
on with your analysis of Mexico, but then thought your wagon got unhinged and you lost your way or something. ( I guess Dennis can only tell us)
Mengano make the "BN" forums speak their mind. I find they often wimp out, and don't tell what's really on their mind. Already a few of them are
trying to take this serious discussion off topic to "La La Land" because they don't want to discuss this serious topic and confront their own demons.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JoeJustJoe
( I guess Dennis can only tell us)
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkwmKZuyF5E
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bajabass
Super Nomad
Posts: 2016
Registered: 10-4-2006
Location: La Paz,BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Want to fish!!!
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I confronted my demons,  flipped them off,  and left them in California.
Keep your eyes on the road, and your hands upon the wheel!
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: |
********************
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And you beat me to the punch, commenting on doltish rambling that is in no way, shape or form applicable to this topic.
That said, along with Dennis' apt observation about free speech, I really think folks have to look around and realize that especially since the
financial meltdown and the jump in unemployment in the US, anti-immigration rhetoric has skyrocketed.
Just watch as we build higher fences. This non-stop bashing of Mexicans which is so prevalent on Fox news cannot but sink into our national psyche.
I'm thinking that the current perceived economic disaster in the US, which can be mostly blamed on massive tax cuts and two useless wars of choice
left unfunded, needs to be covered up by identifying a scapegoat.
Folks who post on this board, by and large, are past, current or future friends of Baja. But, they don't live in a world immune to the constant drone
of blaming foreigners for our mess.
Now, had Calderon not taken a baseball bat to the hornet's nest and caused so much travail within Mexico, things might be a tad less hostile. Yet,
given the fact that housing inflation was obscuring the decrease in good paying jobs throughout the US for over a decade, seems like all chickens came
home to roost at the same time.
Obviously Jesse perceives an increased negativity in the tone of posts on here. But he also ought to understand that the world beyond Nomad has been
stirring this up for a long time.
[Edited on 11-24-2011 by BajaNomad]
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ElCazadorAZ
Junior Nomad
Posts: 58
Registered: 11-6-2011
Location: Arizona Territory
Member Is Offline
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I would just have to add, as a FNG here, that I feel safer in the Baja California part of Mexico than I do in most parts of Phoenix, Tucson, Las
Vegas, Albuquerque, New Orleans, Washington DC, etc., etc., etc. The publicity associated with the recent brutal Mexican crime is eye candy to the US
news-junkie masses. For one thing, beheading is definitely not part of our culture and very dramatic, without a doubt. I'll butt back out of this one
with this flabby old cliche': If you look for trouble, you will find it. I'll add to that: If you really DIG trouble, you'll revel in it when you DO
find it.... H.
"If we're all thinking alike, somebody's not thinking." Gen. George S. Patton
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mengano
| Quote: | Originally posted by Iflyfish
Erick Berne, M.D. described a Psychological Game called "Ain't It Awful". This game is played by constantly seeing the negative in everything and
spending time focused upon it. It reinforces the existential position of the protagonist "I'm superior" and that is a cover for deep insecurity and
feelings of low self worth. This game can be played between the "Parents" of two or more people and can become a Pastime, like talking about Baseball
or where I found the cheapest ..... you name it. |
What a great, in-depth internet psychiatric analysis. Do you do a lot of testifying as an expert witness on psychological matters? Of course, if you
are really interested in that, you should also read, "I'm OK, You're OK", by Thomas A Harris MD.
Pointing out that somebody is lying in order to advance his own personal agenda is not a psychological game, nor is it anything that one needs to be
cured of. Altruism is not a mental illness. As Freud may have said, "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar." |
I am glad you appreciate my in-depth internet psychiatric analysis. Having retired and surrendered my license, I can no longer diagnose nor treat
Mental Health Conditions. I can no longer be called as an expert witness. I have hung up my shingle from a very satisfying career. My seven years
training in Transactional Analysis and Gestalt Therapies exposed me to the work of Harris as well as others in the field.
I apologize for my lack of clarity and am sorry for any confusion I might have generated. I made no reference to anyone lying and my post was not
intended to do so. Further I believe that altruism exists across the animal kingdom and never intended to propose that it is pathological. Sometimes a
cigar is indeed just a cigar and sometimes it is indeed more (ask Bill Clinton).
The point of my rather obtuse post was to share with Jesse and others that there are indeed people who spend their time “sniffing sh..” and who
structure their lives around that function. I believe this to be cross cultural in nature. I believe that people who structure their social
interactions around “Ain’t It Awful” will not give up their game in the face of new information etc. because to do so would require a great deal of
effort and a shift in psychology, which is not easy.
I appreciate and share the perspective of lizard lips regarding crime in Mexico. I have traveled Mexico for over 45 years and am glad I have been to
the places he mentions and no longer feel safe in them. I missed the siege of Morelia by 15 minutes last winter and saw the aftermath.
Having said that about crime I still love Mexico and there are places I would go in a heartbeat. About a month ago I spent another three weeks on the
mainland and was in an area that was very safe. There was one murder during my time there in contrast to about six in Portland, Oregon where I live in
a suburb. One needs awareness as well as perspective when traveling to other countries and Mexico is no exception.
In my view it is very possible to be aware and enjoy at the same time. Many live in fear and it limits their ability to find joy in life. Many spend
their time looking for the negative and find their meaning in doing so. There are other people who live “Sunny Side Up” and their “rose colored
glasses” can be very dangerous to wear.
I have met many Americans and Canadians in Mexico who spend their time talking about what does not work and taking pride in their last economic
conquest in Mexico. I find these people boring. I also understand that there are a limited number of ways that one can structure out time between when
the sun goes up and when it goes down. I like to hang around intelligent people who are aware and know how to play. I have met many people who have
set about the life work of unmasking the incompetence of those older or wiser than they (parents) and I find myself very intolerant of the “Yes/But”
game. I believe that we cannot write a sentence without it reflecting our psychology. I also believe that contempt is toxic and don’t book it well.
I hope this clarifies my post and addresses any confusion I may have created.
Iflyfish
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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
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Just to recap my point of view:
1.-Its cool to post bad stuff about baja
2.-Its cool to post bad stuff about baja
3.-Its cool to have different points of view
3.-Its NOT cool to sit around all day posting just negative crap
4.-Its NOT cool to come and post here when your agenda is just "i hate mexico"
5.-Its NOT cool to forget why we came here in the first place, to read and learn, and enjoy the good things in baja
Just my two centavos, everyone else has the right to do what they please.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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I love my "rose colored glasses", and they have served me well over many years (so far) and kept me, as well as those around me, pretty happy. If
there IS "danger" there, then it sure feels good---but sometimes "danger" is the spice of life, especially if you don't take it too seriously.
 
Good post, Fish.
Barry
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Mulegena
Super Nomad
Posts: 2412
Registered: 11-7-2006
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by woody with a view
... that said, i'm sure EVERY ONE of us might have uttered the dreaded words that Mexico is an armpit of the world at one time or another. or at
least been interpreted as having done so. |
Don't believe this is the case with myself or others I hold dear,
but yeah I've heard it.
| Quote: | Originally posted by woody with a view
Happy Dia de Zopilote a TODO!!!! |
and yes, speaking of inconsistencies, I'm of Native blood but I love the celebration of Thanksgiving-- my fav holiday. In keeping with the Native
American/Indian philosophy I try to remember and give thanks throughout each day... and smile, too.
So, for a little humour, this: http://www.elephantjournal.com/2011/11/damn-illegal-immigran...
"Raise your words, not your voice. It's rain that grows flowers, not thunder." ~Rumi
"It's the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." ~ Aristotle
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Roberto
Banned
Posts: 2162
Registered: 9-5-2003
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by woody with a view
i don't REALLY care, but could we get some names of the worst offenders? maybe a link to the thread that chapped your hide?
a title like -> "Subject: Anti-Mexico gang keeps growing" is really just like BajaRich saying "do you like Loreto or Calexico?" there is too much
subjectivity to lead to an apples to apples conversation.
that said, i'm sure EVERY ONE of us might have uttered the dreaded words that Mexico is an armpit of the world at one time or another. or at least
been interpreted as having done so.
Happy Dia de Zopilote a TODO!!!! |
Vulture day? Huh? Perhaps you meant pavo?
[Edited on 11-24-2011 by Roberto]
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ElCazadorAZ
Junior Nomad
Posts: 58
Registered: 11-6-2011
Location: Arizona Territory
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | | Happy Dia de Zopilote a TODO!!!! |
You're eating Vulture? Buzzard? Owl? Mmm-MMM!
"If we're all thinking alike, somebody's not thinking." Gen. George S. Patton
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Roberto
Banned
Posts: 2162
Registered: 9-5-2003
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JESSE
Just to recap my point of view:
1.-Its cool to post bad stuff about baja
2.-Its cool to post bad stuff about baja
3.-Its cool to have different points of view
3.-Its NOT cool to sit around all day posting just negative crap
4.-Its NOT cool to come and post here when your agenda is just "i hate mexico"
5.-Its NOT cool to forget why we came here in the first place, to read and learn, and enjoy the good things in baja
Just my two centavos, everyone else has the right to do what they please. |
You forgot:
6. - I just have a problem with some people and will try to
make criticisms about them and pass them as legitimate whenever I feel like it.
[Edited on 11-24-2011 by Roberto]
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
I love my "rose colored glasses", and they have served me well over many years (so far) and kept me, as well as those around me, pretty happy. If
there IS "danger" there, then it sure feels good---but sometimes "danger" is the spice of life, especially if you don't take it too seriously.
Good post, Fish.
Barry |
Sometimes fear and excitement are very close to eachother! This is why it is important to have a safe word for those who are really into it.
Iflyfish
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
Member Is Offline
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Love that picture.
THANKS
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Roberto
Vulture day? Huh? Perhaps you meant pavo?
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Or this..........guajolote.
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8088
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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"Aint it Awful"
Iflyfish,
How do you explain the love affair the nation had with Andy Rooney, a man who made a reputation of doing just the sort of thing that you paint so
negative?
Just curious on your take on that.
Oh wait a minute. I guess that makes this a "Yes, but" post. I guess that's why I've never liked psychology very much. It makes me too self conscious.
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
Member Is Offline
Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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but, with humor .. IMHO ...
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Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
Iflyfish,
How do you explain the love affair the nation had with Andy Rooney, a man who made a reputation of doing just the sort of thing that you paint so
negative?
Just curious on your take on that.
Oh wait a minute. I guess that makes this a "Yes, but" post. I guess that's why I've never liked psychology very much. It makes me too self conscious.
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I appreciate a critical thinking mind, one that questions, is curious, has a sense of wonder, and is iconoclastic when the situation presents itself
to take down an idol. You ask a great question. We have engaged in numerous discussions on this board and you consistently display an inquiring,
curios mind. You love to share information, experience and knowledge. If you read carefully others postings you will see patterns of interactions in
which games are played with the goal of discrediting the author rather than learning from their interactions. You see the predictable put downs, the
Ain’t It Awful game that Jesse has identified.
Self consciousness is a very valuable thing if it is not chronically self critical. Self consciousness can be self awareness if experienced from the
thinking part of us rather than the critical part of us. Your awareness of the potential of me or others putting you down and victimizing you with a
prosecutorial retort claiming you are playing “Aint It Awful” actually demonstrates a rather sophisticated awareness of social interactions and the
potential of a game emerging out of a transaction. I congratulate your preemptive strike against it. This is a sign of intelligence on your part and
an attempt to have a game free dialogue based upon genuine curiosity. This is refreshing. It is possible to learn when one takes this stance. Engaging
in earnest discussion and debate is about learning, satisfying our curiosity, generating equality and equanimity by engaging in intellectual dialogue
and stroking as we learn. This is a different matter than reading anthers writing in order to find the flaw and demonstrate that they are flawed,
inferior, a fraud after all, just like their over critical biological parent or parent figure. “See, dad (mom) is really full of crap, even though he
tries to look so good”. “See we real Americans are superior to these …….substitute a racial slur here….”
We all love to see the emperor without his clothes, the great knocked down a notch, hubris confronted etc. That is a different matter than organizing
ones sense of self around finding the negative in EVERYTHING as an existential position in life. We enjoy Andy Rooney, we have an "affair" with him,
if we are healthy we don't become him, we become our authentic selves and are capable of intimacy. Andy Rooney made a life's work of saying some of
the things that all of us might have wanted to say but were too repressed to do so. He was a loveable curmudgeon, an inappropriate uncle who spoke his
authentic mind. He was a critic who loved the world he critiqued. We also love our comedians for doing the same thing, John Stewart is an excellent
snarky example of this.
There are a limited number of adaptive strategies we can employ as human beings to address the issue of who we are and how we fit in the world and how
we go about acquiring out stroking. Erick Berne, M.D. identified three Psychological Roles on can assume in the world if one is to assume a role, and
most of us do. One role is Victim, another Persecutor and yet another, the role of Rescuer. A game is played by switching between these roles. You
start out in one role and then end up in another via a series of predictable moves that end up with the same outcome. These games generate emotions,
structure time and reinforce existential positions. We all require emotional stroking and need to structure social interaction. Rescuers ultimately
become Victims etc. There are real rescuers in the world, they have red crosses on their sleeves and there are real victims, they have buildings fall
on them, and there are Prosecutors in the legal system. Then there are the Psychological Persecutors, Rescuers and Victims to which we are referring.
Berne was a Social Psychiatrist and analyzed transactions between people. By analyzing these transactions he identified a series of psychological
games.
Here is a list of games and their functions.
http://tinyurl.com/75k7ju8
My point in all of this is that there are psychological motivations behind some of the positions that people chronically take and we can see them over
time. No amount of information, analysis or persuasion will change someone else’s position if their goal is to play a psychological game. The goal is
not an exchange of information but rather to engage in a series of exchanges with a clearly predictable emotional outcome.
An example of what I am talking about is this. Notice how some people get themselves consistently kicked when they post the same catch phrases over
and over…. The game is called “Kick Me”. It is played to acquire stroking by getting others to “dump” on them. These are the kids on the playground
that consistently get other kids to be peeed off at them and to hit, kick, punch and ridicule them. This is not to say that there are not innocent
victims of bullying, there are real victims. Then there are those who consistently set themselves up to get kicked.
There are genuine problems with safety in Mexico. Baja has been somewhat blessed by its geographical situation relative to the main shipping routes of
the Drug Cartels. Much like the US was in its early years buffered from much of what went on in Europe because of it being surrounded by oceans. It is
sad for us who love Baja to see it hurt by these folks and we all have a right to legitimate anger and outrage over tragedies that we see before our
eyes. However it is also true that most of the territory of the Baja is relatively free of the horrors of the Cartels and we can hope that its
geography can continue to provide some protection. It is also true that much of what we love about Baja and Mexico still remain and will always do so
just as was true in the USofA during our Prohibition when the gangs ran wild on the soil of the north.
Iflyfish
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Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8088
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
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"Kick Me"
| Quote: | Originally posted by Iflyfish
The game is called “Kick Me”. It is played to acquire stroking by getting others to “dump” on them.
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Are you saying that they play kick me to gain sympathy? To have others step in and say nice things. An indirect way of generating praise?
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Well, it's 11:30 now, almost Thanksgiving.
So from one curmudgeon to another - "Happy Holidays".
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