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wessongroup
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roads
| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaGringo
Actually that was not translated accurately from the article. The linked article said that agents at the toll gate had heard of 3 or 4 similar events
on the same day the little girl was hurt. A bit different from 3 to 4 events per day, implying that there are over a hundred or more such events on
the toll road each month. But whatever it was it is still a very sad thing indeed.
The USA DOJ reports that carjackings and burglaries are up as well on the other side of the border. The recession/depression is leading to more and
more events like this world wide and I doubt we will see things improving much anytime soon. You need to be careful wherever you go today...
Well said..
| Quote: | Originally posted by mtgoat666
| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
There are 3 to 4 reports per DAY of rocks being thrown at cars on the Scenic Highway. |
that's a lot. if we assume that for every 3 or 4 reports, an additional 6 to 8 are unreported, and assume that 5,000 cars per day travel the road,
then each car passing has greater than 1/1000 chance of being target.
many of you buy lotto tickets with much worse odds. |
[Edited on 11-12-2009 by BajaGringo] |
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Eugenio
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| Quote: | Originally posted by CaboRon
| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
I'm not so sure than it's the illegals who are responsible for a disproportionate amount of crime. I welcome your statistical evidence.
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According to INS and FBI statistics from 2006, 29 percent of all the inmates in all state and federal prisons are illegal aliens.
http://www.wwaytv3.com/node/9902
Estimated number of illegal aliens in the US = 12,000,000
Current US population = 308,000,000
Percentage of US population that is illegal = 4%
Percentage of illegals in US prisons = 29%
Therefore illegal aliens are overrepresented in prisons by a factor of 7.5:1.
That really understates the numbers, since 100% of illegals are breaking US laws just by being here, their crime rate is 100%. Why, if I may ask,
would you think that people who knowingly break US laws by entering illegally and knowingly work here without legal work rights, would somehow be
honest and upright members of society in all other matters? ? |
The politically correct might dissagree ... However you speak the truth ...
 |
The gradual decrease in crime that has been experienced in the US over the past 15 years or so corresponds with an overall increase in illegal
immigration (last year or so excepted) - so I know you guys would be the first to stand up and attribute that decrease in crime to the calming
influence of illegals.
(this is what you get when simpleminded dopes with an agenda take on a situation with a lot of variables)
And Arrowhead - I'm not buying your prison stats - they've been floating around the internet for months - but nobody really seems to be able to verify
them with hard data - that is the source - - care to show us the original references for the (supposed) INS and FBI stats?
Chau muchachos.
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Bajahowodd
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"The gradual decrease in crime that has been experienced in the US over the past 15 years or so corresponds with an overall increase in illegal
immigration (last year or so excepted) - so I know you guys would be the first to stand up and attribute that decrease in crime to the calming
influence of illegals."
Like during economic boom times, when there were more jobs than workers available?
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arrowhead
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Eugenio
And Arrowhead - I'm not buying your prison stats - they've been floating around the internet for months - but nobody really seems to be able to verify
them with hard data - that is the source - - care to show us the original references for the (supposed) INS and FBI stats?
Chau muchachos. |
OK, would you take the word of the Government Accounting Office in a report to Congress?
| Quote: |
Summary
The former Immigration and Naturalization Service estimated that as of January 2000 the total unauthorized immigrant population residing in the United
States was 7 million. This total includes those who entered the United States illegally and those who entered legally but overstayed their authorized
period of stay. A more recent study estimated that there were about 10 million illegal aliens living in the United States as of March 2005. The study
estimated that nearly 700,000 aliens entered the United States illegally or overstayed their authorized period of stay each year between 2000 and
2004. Some illegal aliens in the United States have been arrested and incarcerated in federal and state prisons and local jails, adding to already
overcrowded prisons and jails. On April 7, 2005, we issued a report on criminal aliens that were incarcerated in federal and state prisons and local
jails. Our report contained information on the number of criminal aliens incarcerated, their country of citizenship or country of birth, and the cost
to incarcerate them. Congress also requested that we provide information on the criminal history of aliens incarcerated in federal and state prisons
or local jails who had entered the country illegally. For a population of aliens that entered the country illegally and were incarcerated in federal
or state prisons or local jails, this report addresses the following questions: (1) How many times have they been arrested? (2) How many and what type
of criminal offenses have they been arrested for? (3) What states were they arrested in?
In our population study of 55,322 illegal aliens, we found that they were arrested at least a total of 459,614 times, averaging about 8 arrests per
illegal alien. Nearly all had more than 1 arrest. Thirty-eight percent (about 21,000) had between 2 and 5 arrests, 32 percent (about 18,000) had
between 6 and 10 arrests, and 26 percent (about 15,000) had 11 or more arrests. Most of the arrests occurred after 1990. They were arrested for a
total of about 700,000 criminal offenses, averaging about 13 offenses per illegal alien. One arrest incident may include multiple offenses, a fact
that explains why there are nearly one and half times more offenses than arrests. Almost all of these illegal aliens were arrested for more than 1
offense. Slightly more than half of the 55,322 illegal aliens had between 2 and 10 offenses. About 45 percent of all offenses were drug or immigration
offenses. About 15 percent were property-related offenses such as burglary, larceny-theft, motor vehicle theft, and property damage. About 12 percent
were for violent offenses such as murder, robbery, assault, and sex-related crimes. The balance was for such other offenses as traffic violations,
including driving under the influence; fraud--including forgery and counterfeiting; weapons violations; and obstruction of justice. Eighty percent of
all arrests occurred in three states--California, Texas, and Arizona. Specifically, about 58 percent of all arrests occurred in California, 14 percent
in Texas, and 8 percent in Arizona.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d05646r.pdf
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..and check out table 2 in this pdf from the DOJ:
http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/p08.pdf
| Quote: | Imprisonment rate per 100,000 population 2008:
White males: 487
Hispanic males: 1200 |
Just some advice, when you are in a debate NEVER ask a question that you do not already know the answer to.
No soy por ni contra apatía.
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Skipjack Joe
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Poor Joan. I think you're right, though. I hear they usually die of smoke inhalation before .... you know. I suppose it's better that way.
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Eugenio
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| Quote: | Originally posted by arrowhead
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
I'm not so sure than it's the illegals who are responsible for a disproportionate amount of crime. I welcome your statistical evidence.
|
According to INS and FBI statistics from 2006, 29 percent of all the inmates in all state and federal prisons are illegal aliens.
http://www.wwaytv3.com/node/9902
Estimated number of illegal aliens in the US = 12,000,000
Current US population = 308,000,000
Percentage of US population that is illegal = 4%
Percentage of illegals in US prisons = 29%
Therefore illegal aliens are overrepresented in prisons by a factor of 7.5:1.
That really understates the numbers, since 100% of illegals are breaking US laws just by being here, their crime rate is 100%. Why, if I may ask,
would you think that people who knowingly break US laws by entering illegally and knowingly work here without legal work rights, would somehow be
honest and upright members of society in all other matters? ? |
Percentage of illegals in US prisons = 29% ??? Yeah - right.
These reports don't in any way address the percentage of illegal aliens in the US prison system - in fact they show you're wrong.
Geez man - did you think I wasn't going to read them?
The first reference doesn't say anything about the non-illegal alien prison population - so it's worthless as far as calculating the percentage of
illegals in the prison population.
As for your second reference your quote is misleading (as usual) - these numbers are based on the "referenced" population - not the general population
- read the methodology if you can. In other words incarceration rates for whites are about 0.5% and 1.2% for hispanics. That's "hispanics" - not
"illegal aliens".
In addition your second reference claims 34% of sentenced prisoners are white - and 20% hispanic. (see data directly above Table 1) Great - now
please explain to me how you get "29% illegals in the prison population". It's impossible - unless of course you had many many millions of white
illegal aliens running around committing crimes.
But that can't be true because we all know that white folk don't do crime like hispanics and blacks.
sheesh dude - what a friggin waste of time it is asking you to be anything even remotely close to honest....
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k-rico
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Whoa Nellie, stop the presses!
Aren't there illegal aliens in prison for BEING illegal aliens, and not committing any other crimes? The euphemism is "ICE detainees". I don't think
there are any people in prison for being legal.
Comparing the two using ratios is problematic. Isn't it?
Dang it, we're arresting all the short people because they're short. We don't bother tall people unless they have six fingers on each hand. And you
know something, there's a lot more short people in prison than you woulda thunk eventhough most people are tall.
And then there's the prison vs. jail thingamaroo. Illegal immigration is a federal offense. The federal gov doesn't run jails, only prisons. So if
you're an ICE detainee, even for one week before deportation, you're in prison. Legal folks don't go to prison unless the sentence is one year or
more. Under that you're in a city or county jail.
Send my bail to the Tijuana jail.
I usually am confused, so I could be confused. If so, nevermind.
Safe Harbor Statement:
If the premise that ICE detainees are counted as part of the prison population is untrue, then I'm entirely incorrect.
[Edited on 12-18-2009 by k-rico]
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wessongroup
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"According to"... just a couple of thoughts .. "Gulf of Tonkin" ... "Yellow Cake"... Colin Powell and all brought to you from your Government...
I take government reports under advisement....
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k-rico
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| Quote: | Originally posted by wessongroup
I take government reports under advisement.... |
The inability of WWAY TV News Channel 3 reporters to read and comprehend (article cited by arrowhead) is probably more of an issue.
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by k-rico
If the premise that ICE detainees are counted as part of the prison population is untrue, then I'm entirely incorrect.
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There's a difference between jail and prison. I doubt illegals are sent to prison only for being illegal.
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k-rico
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Office of Detention and Removal (DRO)
"Simply stated, DRO's ultimate goal is to develop the capacity to identify and remove all removable aliens"
DRO secures bed space in detention facilities, and monitors these facilities for compliance with national Detention Standards. The standards specify
the living conditions appropriate for detainees. These standards have been collated and published in the Detention Operations Manual. This Manual
provides uniform policies and procedures concerning the treatment of individuals detained by ICE.
ICE operates eight secure detention facilities called Service Processing Centers (SPCs). They are located in Aguadilla, Puerto Rico; Batavia, New
York; El Centro, California; El Paso, Texas; Florence, Arizona; Miami, Florida; Los Fresnos, Texas; and San Pedro, California. The newest SPC, the
Buffalo Federal Detention Facility, is unique because in addition to its 300 beds for detained aliens, it has 150 beds for use by the U.S. Marshals
Service.
ICE augments its SPC's with seven contract detention facilities. These facilities are located in Aurora, Colorado; Houston, Texas; Laredo, Texas;
Seattle, Washington; Elizabeth, New Jersey; Queens, New York; and San Diego, California. ICE also uses state and local jails on a reimbursable
detention day basis and has joint federal facilities with the Bureau of Prisons, the Federal Detention Center in Oakdale, Louisiana, and the
contractor owned and operated (with the Bureau of Prisons) criminal alien facility in Eloy, Arizona. In addition, major expansion initiatives
are underway at several SPCs' to enhance DROs detention capabilities.
http://www.ice.gov/pi/dro/
[Edited on 12-18-2009 by k-rico]
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DENNIS
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Is that just FYI stuff or a reply to my comment?
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Taco de Baja
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In doing some research on the number of people in prison, probation, or parole in the USA, I've discovered a link between the prison population in
the USA and global warming (or, CO2 levels, if you prefer)! The rising curves are very similar. If we don't do something soon the
prison population may reach 15,201,006 by 2050 and possibly as high as 45,300,601 by 2100!
Other tidbits from good-ole Wikipedia:
In 2002, 93.2% of prisoners were male. About 10.4% of all black males in the United States between the ages of 25 and 29 were sentenced and in
prison, compared to 2.4% of Hispanic males and 1.3% of white males.
In 2005, about 1 out of every 136 U.S. residents was incarcerated either in prison or jail.
A 2005 report estimated that 27% of federal prison inmates are noncitizens, convicted of crimes while in the country legally or
illegally. However, federal prison inmates are only a 6 percent of the total incarcerated population; noncitizen populations in state and local
prisons are more difficult to establish. The World Prison Brief puts the total number of foreign prisoners in all federal, state and local
facilities at 5.9%.
5.9% is still higher (50% higher) than their over all percent of the population 12,000,000 / 308,000,000 = 3.9%.
--------------------------
[Edited on 12-18-2009 by Taco de Baja]
Truth generally lies in the coordination of antagonistic opinions
-Herbert Spencer
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DENNIS
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WOW.....What happened in 1980 to elevate the incarcerated population so dramatically?
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The Gull
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
WOW.....What happened in 1980 to elevate the incarcerated population so dramatically? |
Reagan Welfare Cuts and Workfare programs.
NFL roster reductions?
End of the Draft?
�I won\'t insult your intelligence by suggesting that you really believe what you just said.� William F. Buckley, Jr.
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Martyman
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Jails changed their philosophy from rehabilitation to punishment in the 1980s. The recitivism rates skyrocketed. Prison are seeing the mistake
finally and starting to work on rehab again.
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lingililingili
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I just now read about Karem and I am very sorry, my thoughts are with her parents.
•Life is just one damned thing after another
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comitan
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The incarcerated Americans chart leads me to believe that the fault for the increase starting in the eighties is the fault of Dr. Spock, that is in
the time frame for when his teachings would be having an effect.
Strive For The Ideal, But Deal With What\'s Real.
Every day is a new day, better than the day before.(from some song)
Lord, Keep your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth.
“The sincere pursuit of truth requires you to entertain the possibility that everything you believe to be true may in fact be false”
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by comitan
The incarcerated Americans chart leads me to believe that the fault for the increase starting in the eighties is the fault of Dr. Spock, that is in
the time frame for when his teachings would be having an effect.
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Yep...Just a few more spankings and the world would be a better place.
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arrowhead
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
WOW.....What happened in 1980 to elevate the incarcerated population so dramatically? |
Doncha remember all that "get-tough-on-crime" legislation during the Reagan years? Remember three strikes, and all those increased jail-terms that
were legislated?
No soy por ni contra apatía.
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