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tiotomasbcs
Super Nomad
Posts: 1837
Registered: 7-30-2007
Location: El Pescadero
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New Oxxo and Pemex in Bahia Asuncion yet? I think Shari said the locals would like it?! I try to avoid ours in Pescadero and buy from the small
local stores. Nice people-real people; the kids help me load those garafones/5 gal water bottles. Nice touch! Tio
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64755
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DavidE
Just wait'll you need to decide
The Oxxo
or
Squat |
OH DAH-VEED, SO FUNNY!
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
| Quote: | Originally posted by rhintransit
whatever one thinks about the products available at OXXO's (and they are simply more numerous than the colas and chips and peanuts sold by the mom and
pop stores) it is great to have clean, well maintained bathrooms available wherever they spring up. less toilet paper strewn highways?
as to competition, small or otherwise stores will adapt or die. it's kinda nice here in Loreto now...Ley's moved in, the only other large grocery in
town has cleaned up/reorganized, and sales people actually greet and smile at customers. the other day at in another well known grocery store in
town, owner came over to shake my hand when I walked in.
our gringo input on the matter of what store where is irrelevant... |
Right on... the consumer should win, and the free market benefits all... the public bathrooms are an interesting twist I hadn't considered... healthy
for the environment! |
Hate to break it to you, but the free market does not necessarily benefit ALL.
Behemoths like Walmart, for instance move in and shut down many local businesses, while offering minimum wage jobs with little or no benefits. That
does not benefit ALL.
Free market is more like economic Dawinism, Where the big consume the little.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
| Quote: | Originally posted by rhintransit
whatever one thinks about the products available at OXXO's (and they are simply more numerous than the colas and chips and peanuts sold by the mom and
pop stores) it is great to have clean, well maintained bathrooms available wherever they spring up. less toilet paper strewn highways?
as to competition, small or otherwise stores will adapt or die. it's kinda nice here in Loreto now...Ley's moved in, the only other large grocery in
town has cleaned up/reorganized, and sales people actually greet and smile at customers. the other day at in another well known grocery store in
town, owner came over to shake my hand when I walked in.
our gringo input on the matter of what store where is irrelevant... |
Right on... the consumer should win, and the free market benefits all... the public bathrooms are an interesting twist I hadn't considered... healthy
for the environment! |
Hate to break it to you, but the free market does not necessarily benefit ALL.
Behemoths like Walmart, for instance move in and shut down many local businesses, while offering minimum wage jobs with little or no benefits. That
does not benefit ALL.
Free market is more like economic Dawinism, Where the big consume the little. |
Perhaps sometimes, but the FREE MARKET in general DOES benefit all if they are willing to compete, and the citizens are willing to support their
neighbors in small business. Many small business's remain viable by offering what the big-box stores can't, PERSONAL SERVICE. Many citizens frequent
the small business for this reason alone---------I certainly do. It's worth paying a little more for that service. Competition always raises the
bar-----for everybody generally speaking, IMO. Nothing works perfectly, however.
Barry
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
Member Is Offline
Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Hate to break it to you, but the free market does not necessarily benefit ALL.
Behemoths like Walmart, for instance move in and shut down many local businesses, while offering minimum wage jobs with little or no benefits. That
does not benefit ALL.
Free market is more like economic Dawinism, Where the big consume the little. |
Hey, Odd.......I hate to break it to you.......
When was the last time you were in Ensenada on a Sunday????
Both Wal-Marts, COSTCO, Home Depot, Mc Donald's, Carl Jr.......can't find a parking place, "big box" stores all full of people shopping, spending
money and employing local residents raising their standard of living.
Mom & pops either need to compete, offer something different or work for the "big box" where they will probably make more than they did running
their little store....where they didn't have benefits or a guaranteed wage
[Edited on 9-28-2013 by bajaguy]
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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My response to David K was because of his absolutist conviction on the free market. Sure, those big chain outlets are doing gangbuster business.
This is a very complex issue, and there are clearly differences between large cities such as Ensenada, and smaller towns.
Do you really believe that those big box businesses that pay minimum wage and offer little to no benefits are somehow improving the local economy?
As for DK, I just want to make one point. DK is a small business owner. The huge corporations are playing the small business people for their own
advantage. The last thing small business owners ought to want is an environment where the huge corporations are free to do whatever they want.
Sadly, the corporatocracy controls way too much of our politicians. There needs to be some way to give relief to small business, while tightening
regulation on the huge corporations.
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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"This is a very complex issue, and there are clearly differences between large cities such as Ensenada, and smaller towns."
..and that's why WalMart, Sam's Club and Home Depot aren't there. Nobody is forcing us to shop there and the people that work there are very happy
with the wages they get. Only the unions (that don't represent them) are complaining about wages and benefits in an attempt to sign these people up so
they can collect monthly dues from them.
Bob Durrell
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
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Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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Wal-Mart offshoot
That is why you see the Bodega Aurrera stores popping up in smaller cities...........
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodega_Aurrer%C3%A1
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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Yep, when we were at a resort in Puerto Penesco the
desk clerk told my wife that there was a WaMart in town and gave us directions. Sure enough it was actually a Bodega Aurrera and it was right next
door to a Sam's Club.
Bob Durrell
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monoloco
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Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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Down here in La Paz and los Cabos they are putting up Sorianas everywhere, they're even putting one in the Paraiso Mall in Cabo San Lucas. Should be
handy for the folks with boats in the marina.
"The future ain't what it used to be"
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64755
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
My response to David K was because of his absolutist conviction on the free market. Sure, those big chain outlets are doing gangbuster business.
This is a very complex issue, and there are clearly differences between large cities such as Ensenada, and smaller towns.
Do you really believe that those big box businesses that pay minimum wage and offer little to no benefits are somehow improving the local economy?
As for DK, I just want to make one point. DK is a small business owner. The huge corporations are playing the small business people for their own
advantage. The last thing small business owners ought to want is an environment where the huge corporations are free to do whatever they want.
Sadly, the corporatocracy controls way too much of our politicians. There needs to be some way to give relief to small business, while tightening
regulation on the huge corporations. |
So no jobs beats a LOT of entry level pay jobs? Ma and Pa stores hire family members and maybe 1 or 2 others.
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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I give up. Go to your tea parties.
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mulegemichael
Super Nomad
Posts: 2310
Registered: 12-24-2007
Location: sequim,wa. and mulege
Member Is Offline
Mood: up on step
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i give up too....kindof...big box stores employ folks that are mostly unemployable ...minimum wage kinda stuff....and they crank stuff out at
unbelievably low prices...but they do NOT offer,or GIVE anything about community...they do NOT ask how your mom is or how was the coming of age party
last night...they are not the folks that will be at your bbq this sunday....MOST of the employees come from outside the community and do not
contribute to the soul of what is important to the community....i guess my point is, how does one weigh the affordability of a faucet against the
relationship with ones neighbors???....did i make any sense here????...probably not...but i'm used to criticism
dyslexia is never having to say you\'re yrros.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64755
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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You get some false assumption that I like the big box stores... I don't. I prefer the ma and pa places. It is just a matter of what business is it of
some gringos to dictate what Mexicans can have or do in Mexico? Wal-Mart and 7-11s are a part of the scene in the USA, but Mexico can't have them too?
Nobody forces anyone to shop there. If the people want ma and pa stores to stay in business than they can choose to keep things unchanged by not
shopping in the big or franchise stores. Voting with their money...
As for tea parties, I think the last one I went to was in 1962 when the little neighbor girl had one for me at 5 years of age!
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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..and more than 50% of what they sell in Hecho en Mexico which does help the economy
"Walmart boasts that 87 percent of its merchandise sold in Mexican stores comes from national suppliers — companies such as Guadalajara-based Nopal
Industrializado, which sells low-calorie and high-fiber tortillas, tostadas and totopos made from cactus flour under the “Señor Cactus” label."
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Wal-Mart de México y Centroamérica (BMV: WALMEXV), is a Mexican public corporation. It has been traded in the Mexican Stock Exchange since 1977 (as
Cifra).[1] The company was founded in 1958 as Cifra by Jerónimo Arango. The company grew and in 1991 Cifra and Wal-Mart Stores, Inc., signed a joint
venture agreement. This agreement allowed cooperation between the two companies and the opening of Walmart stores and Sam's Clubs in Mexico. Then in
1997 Walmart increased its stake by acquiring 51% of Cifra stock. Once the acquisition was completed Cifra was renamed, the new company became
Wal-Mart de Mexico, S.A. de C.V. Walmart again increased its stake in Wal-Mart de Mexico to 60% in April 2000.[2] After completing the acquisition of
Walmart's operations in Central America, in January 2010, Walmart Mexico absorbed Walmart Centroamérica and changed their name to Walmart de Mexico y
Centroamérica.
At the end of December 2011 Walmart operates 2037 retail outlets in Mexico including restaurants and supermarkets, under the names Walmart, Superama,
Suburbia, VIPS, Sam's Club and Bodega Aurrerá. As of 2012 the company was Mexico's largest private sector employer with 209,000
employees. One fifth of the Walmart stores in the world are in Mexico.[3] It competes with Soriana, Comercial Mexicana, Chedraui, H-E-B, Casa
Ley, and S-Mart.
Wal-Mart de México y Centroamérica is the biggest retail company in Latin America.
Walmex's restaurant division, Vips, was acquired by the Mexican restaurant company, Alsea, in September 2013 for around $626
million.[4]
Bob Durrell
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
Member Is Offline
Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by mulegemichael
"....MOST of the employees come from outside the community and do not contribute to the soul of what is important to the community...."
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And where do you get this info???
So the employees of the Ensenada two Wal-Marts, the Home Depot and the COSTCO are from outside of the "community"?????.........not eating that
sandwich.
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laventana
Nomad
Posts: 216
Registered: 8-24-2006
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Mood: sharing
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| Quote: | Originally posted by monoloco
It all depends where they're going to put it. I don't know about El Triunfo, but in Todos Santos, there are zoning regulations requiring that anything
built in the downtown historical district has to comply with architectural guidelines to maintain the character of the town, which IMHO is a good
thing, so it would actually be a case of Mexicans telling Mexicans what should be happening. |
This is true in Durango, Mexico, in the old town of Durango all buildings must meet that areas period old look. and the McDonalds there is absolutely
stunning, no external lighted signage. (can not remeber but maybe no sign outside what so ever.) It is built to fit in the theme and boy did they
meet that criteria. Probably the nicest looking McDonalds I have ever seen and inside, i have seen some (very few) nice ones in the US. Puts the
new modern looking ones to shame. So zoning does work if they have it.
LaVentana, not far from El Triunfo is also getting our OXXO as we speak, they broke ground a month ago. I am not sure they can survive in our
town. Two years ago another similar theme opened several hundred yards down the street and failed almost immediately. Well they were not a
chain and not organized. This will be the difference if OXXO succeeds here. Plus it will be interesting to see where OXXO can find employees
to work for LaPaz wages. Our local wages are 2-3 times higher than LaPaz.
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motoged
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6481
Registered: 7-31-2006
Location: Kamloops, BC
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Mood: Gettin' Better
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"Maybe that is true in Kamloops, BC but certainly untrue in Edmonton. The Corp. that my wife's daughter is part of has 7 francises there and all of
the baked goods are made fresh everyday "
| Quote: | Originally posted by Bob H
| Quote: | Originally posted by motoged
P.S Tim Horton donuts are smaller than they used to be and are mass-produced in distant kitchen instead of the back of each TH's....quality control
at its best.....eh?! |
This from their web site:
Tim Hortons donuts and baked goods are prepared at our bakery in Brantford, Ontario, Canada. Prior to serving, they are baked and finished (with
fillings and/or glazes/icings) at your neighborhood Tim Hortons restaurant. Staff can bake in small batches throughout the day, so that guests should
find their favorite products on the shelf more often. We believe this baking system offers our guests the best product, each and every time.
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I suppose some folks can be fooled into thinking their donuts and stuff are made "on-site", but those who know....don't  They put pre-made stuff in an oven and bake it these days....in the "old days"
TH shops made their own from a recipe on site........and offered variations.
So, Bob, Edmunchuck doesn't really do it differently....even at the W.E. Mall......
[Edited on 9-30-2013 by motoged]
Don't believe everything you think....
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laventana
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Posts: 216
Registered: 8-24-2006
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The locals here in LaVentana are organizing a protest march against OXXO here in LaVentana. They are asking what right do they have to come to
this town, and issues like they pay low wages and take the money from the locals away. The translation on the internet is close to this.
So lets see OXXO will have no business from the local Mexicans. So summer will be a bit tough we go from about 1000 gringos in the winter to 30
gringos in the summer. And most of these gringos will not support the OXXO.
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dtutko1
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Posts: 341
Registered: 8-26-2009
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tiotomasbcs
New Oxxo and Pemex in Bahia Asuncion yet? I think Shari said the locals would like it?! I try to avoid ours in Pescadero and buy from the small
local stores. Nice people-real people; the kids help me load those garafones/5 gal water bottles. Nice touch! Tio |
Say what you want about Oxxo, but if you're in Pescadero some night and need a Magnum ice cream bar.
Dorado Don
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