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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by PT9Baja
off road is a Mexican sport with many Mexican races , Mexican racers and support industry and Mexican fans . Its a passion for many Mexicans. There
as likely to kick it out of Baja as they are of closing Mex 1 the next time someone gets killed on the road. |
ditto for bull fighting 
Bob Durrell
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
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Mood: thriving in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ElFaro
He's from Mexicali correct ? So who is funding him ? and is his truck being built in Mexicali with American expertise and help? Doesn't he own a
business in La Jolla ?
Does it help the Gringos to "let" a Mexican national win the Baja 1000 now and then? Especially now the 1st time in 43 years a Mexican national has
"won" ? |
Back in my days of dirt track racing at Cajon Speedway the same questions were being asked about one of the racers from TJ that won alot of races
there. His name was Ruben Torres and he owned Yankee el Tigre in TJ where he built his own winning car without any US expertise and towed it up to El
Cajon every Friday for the races. Mexican ingenuity and skills are equal to anyone elses.
[Edited on 1-2-2011 by durrelllrobert]
Bob Durrell
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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| Quote: | Originally posted by TW
If it is well marked it is not necesary and perhaps accidents like this one would be avoided.
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I used to go sit in some river-bottom waiting for the race to come by. All the waiting while, I watched the neighborhood delinquents [grown men]
run around and change the course markers. They all thought that was really fun.
I imagine it's a common game and find it hard to believe the drivers rely on the markers at all.
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TMW
Select Nomad
Posts: 10659
Registered: 9-1-2003
Location: Bakersfield, CA
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Most of the car racers have GPS with the course downloaded. The bike and ATV guys don't . I preran the section from Ensenada to Ojos Negos last June
on Thursday before the 500 ( it's only open on Thursday and Friday for outbound only) and I got lost 3 or 4 times and just waited for another
pre-runner to come by. I preran the 1000 course when it first came open and the section just before La Paz, maybe 30 miles out, also had the markers
changed that took me in a circle.
[Edited on 1-2-2011 by TW]
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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Oh geez. I just don't get how or why DavidK seems to feel the need to paste political labels on people who are engaging in a sprited discussion.
Personal opinions are just that. Throwing out terms like liberal and conservative ads nothing to the discussion. Sorry for the hijack, but since this
site was down fo awhile, I'm just now catching up with what I missed.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64722
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Oh geez. I just don't get how or why DavidK seems to feel the need to paste political labels on people who are engaging in a sprited discussion.
Personal opinions are just that. Throwing out terms like liberal and conservative ads nothing to the discussion. Sorry for the hijack, but since this
site was down fo awhile, I'm just now catching up with what I missed. |
Oh geez. I just don't know how or why Bajahowodd seems to feel the need to comment on my writing here instead of addressing the topic or questioning
the obvious political opinions of ElFaro's comments??? I only take time to counter emotional rants with truth and facts... Because I care that folks
understand the consequences of liberalism, I spell it out where it is counter to the good of the people in the name of 'compassion'.
ElFaro wants to end off road racing because someone was hurt... almost acting like off road enthusiasts want people hurt. He believes that there is
little if any positive results from racing in Mexico... or posts what he does hoping to get you to think that.
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ElFaro
Nomad
Posts: 231
Registered: 9-16-2007
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TW
I really appreciate your comments about how the "nuts and bolts" of the B1000 race works. You have alot more experience with the "in the field"
workings than most here including myself and I respect that. I will readily admit ignorance of the day-to-day workings of the "race hour-by-hour
logistics and planning". But I have a fairly good knowledge of how the Mexican government works and how they think after over 30 years of interacting
with them on a "macro" level mostly on the electric energy side.
What I'm having trouble with is by your own admission the racers need to hold down non-race specific costs (e.g. meals, lodging, outside repairs,
etc.) while in Baja and yet SCORE/Sal Fish's claim that all this money is being pumped into the Baja economy as a result of the B1000 race for
example. Just as an example...even though the hotel rooms fill up how many racers are there per room?...probably 3-5 people.
Let's use SCORE'S numbers from the interview Cal posted to back up my claim:
| Quote: | Originally posted by Cap
Score Racing economic impact
| Quote: |
“Our three SCORE Baja races annually produce over $30 million in overall economic impact for Mexico and we are so well-received down there by the
government and the fans it’s a real treat for SCORE and our racers and we looking forward to racing in Baja every year.”
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| Quote: |
"Additional sponsors in Baja are the Secretary of Tourism of Baja California and ProTurismo de Ensenada.
The race [San Felipe 250] annually provides a greater economic impact to San Felipe than the popular month-long 'Spring Break'.
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Outdoor channel interview
It is absolutely silly to think that asking a few local merchants gives any validity to your argument.
Tens of thousands of racers, support crew and fans bring machines from distant locations, and NBC gives the race network air and publicity that isnt
about drug wars, and you can't see anything positive in this? The locals don't make any money?
C'mon..if you just say the acident was a tragedy, and you dont care for the environmental impact of desert racing, you could gain back some
credibilty. |
SCORE/Sal Fish claim "$30 million dollars of 'overall economic impact'" from the three races. Not sure what "overall economic impact" really means
but I'll assume $15 million for the B1000, $10 million for the B500, and $5 million for the SF250. Now if you go back to SCORE's press release B4
the B1000 race they claim "250,000 spectators" will be at the B1000 event.
Divide $15,000,000 by 250,000 = $60 per spectator. Now the race is about 6 weeks before Christmas. If the 250,000 number is mostly Mexicans I fail
to see how they would spend that much per person on average at the B1000 race so close to Xmas. If the 250,000 is mostly foreigners (Americans et.
al.) then I ask myself...are there a quarter of a million visitors coming down to Baja just for the B1000 race with all the "disincentives" there are
now to go to Baja for any reason?
What is the population of Ensenada...about 250,000 alone? If its mostly visitors then why don't I see huge crowds in SCOREVILLE in the videos or
along the race route? 250,000 spectators is about 1 spectator every 21 feet for the 1000 mile route. I watched the finish line in LA Paz at the 2006
or 2008 B1000 race and noticed as the cameraman panned the area as the racers were coming in they were avoiding the bleachers there...the place was
empty...and only one Mexican cameraman. Compare that with high profile Marathon runs where runners straggle in to a large crowd at the finish line
all the time.
SCORE is a PR organization with at least two main purposes...promote off-road racing and build and market an image. They are mostly an office and
cubicles marketing PR through web sites, videos, photos, posters, sponsors, etc...and they are very good at it. There is an appetite for off-road
riding and racing by a section of the public and I don't have a problem with it. But I do have a problem with what I believe are over exaggerated
numbers that SCORE releases for these Baja races that makes them appear to have a bigger impact than they really are.
To be honest I think there are no more than 5,000 hard core race afficionados that attend the B1000 and the money pumped into Baja from the B1000 is
probably between $125,000 and $750,000 tops...not the $15 million and 250,000 spectotors as claimed. If I'm missing something in my assessment of the
financial impact here then please clue me in...Thanks JMHO.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64722
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Wow... you are really having a hard time with basic economics...
People coming into an area increase the amount of business... 10 people spending some is better than one person spending a lot.
Baja racing BRINGS people into Baja who don't live there, thus injecting a BOOST to the local economy. No matter where they spend their money, just
being there raises the economy of the region.
Money spent by race fans, support crews, racers, etc. ends up all over... because where they spend it, then those businesses have more money to spend
themselves... and on and on.
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TMW
Select Nomad
Posts: 10659
Registered: 9-1-2003
Location: Bakersfield, CA
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I don't know what the total amount spent is by everyone involved with the race. I can say what I have spent. In 1992 thru 1994 I sponsored a
motorcycle team "TnT Racing" We spent every weekend, once the race course was open for prerunning. These were usually 3 day weekends. We stayed in
hotels most of the time and ate in resturants and purchased supplies etc while in Baja. This involved two racers for the 250, 3 or 4 for the 500 and 4
for the 1000. We had from 2 to 4 chase vehicles. Often the wives and girl friends would come too. On race weekend we came a day early before
contingency. We used Kawasaki for pits except in 93 when we ran a Black Honda CR250 2 stroke and Honda would not pit a 2 stroke. We won the 500 and
1000, the only non-Kawasaki bike to win it's class at the 1000.
We also raced Lou Paralta's Baja Promotion series both GP and long distance. I believe it was 12 races. Also a Supercross series in Ensenada.The only
races we did not race in Baja was the King of the Desert near El Centro in February and Mammoth Motorcross in June. I spent $75,000 a year on racing
of which $25,000 was for bikes and related gear and supplies at huge discounts. I also helped an ATV team. Approximately $40,000 was spent in Baja per
year for three years. In 1995 they got a factory ride with Kawasaki.
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mtgoat666
Select Nomad
Posts: 18058
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline
Mood: Hot n spicy
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are conservatives capable of emotion?
| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
You see is is a simple matter of Logic vs. Emotion... Conservatives use logic (facts) and (some) liberals use emotion (feelings) to argue their
points.
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dk:
your emotional state is about the same as a 16 year old girl, despite your proclamation that you are an unemotional, logical, vulcan.
i think you are the most emotional participant on this board.
your emotions are what causes you to be so quick to take offense and turn so many threads into a flame wars, and your emotions are the source of your
over use of exclamation points to punctuate evry other sentence
dk: there is nothinng wrong with emotions -- admit it, and let your emotions flow.
anwho, i would never trust a politician lacking emotions....
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64722
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Yah, your right... Group hug???
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rdrrm8e
Nomad
Posts: 252
Registered: 5-14-2007
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Yah, your right... Group hug??? |
tsk tsk
Yah = Yeah
your = you're
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Cap
Nomad
Posts: 202
Registered: 4-20-2007
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I love it when people prove your point for you.
Faro, you just create numbers out of the air for your points and discredit economic impact studies that people paid for. It really is ridiculous.
Granted the economic impact numbers are probably generous, but 30 million dollars is nothing to sneeze at.
| Quote: |
From Wikipedia:
As of 2005, Baja California’s economy represents 3.3% of Mexico’s gross domestic product or 21,996 million USD.[24] Baja California's economy has a
strong focus on tariff-free export oriented manufacturing (maquiladora). As of 2005, 284,255 people are employed in the manufacturing sector.[24]
There are a more than 900 companies operating under the federal Prosec program in Baja California. The average wage for a maquiladora employee in Baja
California is in the range of 2 to 3 US Dollars per hour.
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Something tells me that an organization that provides an economic impact roughly equal to the GDP of the state annually is going to be welcome for a
long time.
While we're on the topic of stimulating the local economy, What have you done personally, or what organizations do you support that have anywhere near
the positive affect of the SCORE races?
Easy with the stones my friend..
Fly low, land on roads.
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