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DianaT
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Quote: Originally posted by DianaT  | | Quote: Originally posted by PaulW | | Difficult to ID them because they are the silent majority. And they do not want publicity as I said before. Their studies and findings are out there
and not in the general public view. We only get snips if their findings and they contradict the reports that have the warming agenda to publicize.
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Okay, I want to learn more. Since they won't go public, where can we access information as to their existence and their findings?
It is difficult to know if something is valid or not if it remains in the shadows.
I am serious as for the sake of my grandchildren, I would LOVE to know that all the other scientists are wrong.
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I guess this is my contribution to the "dogpile", but it is serious question. For the sake of my grandchildren I would love to find out that all I
read from scientists around the world is wrong. That would make me very happy.
So is this not a legitimate question? Who are these hidden scientists and how does one find information about them?
Not being a scientist myself, I do defer to them and like to read different perspectives.
But calling this all a dogpile does little to answer the request for clarification.
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TMW
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The local Weatherman does not believe in Global Warming as presented. He does believe the earth is gradually getting warmer and explains why in his
blog. The part about CO2 is near the end of the article.
http://www.bakersfieldnow.com/weather/blog/112585264.html
Back ground on Miles Muzio.
http://www.bakersfieldnow.com/kbak/bios/149308035.html
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DianaT
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Thank you. That is a start. He is one who thinks warming is going to continue no matter what humans do. Thus, the associated problems will
continue.
More? With his blog, he obviously does feel he needs to keep conclusions hidden. So why would other scientists feel the need to go underground.
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Mexitron
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From the blog:
"Someone commented on my last posting that I had failed to mention the impact of Global Warming on all of this, saying I didn’t believe in it. Indeed,
I have always represented that the earth is gradually getting warmer. I have concluded, however, that humanity is unable to change what is naturally
happening despite our misguided efforts to command the skies. And to that point, I expect the world will continue slowly warming in response to solar
stimulation. As the oceans warm they release more carbon dioxide from a dissolved state in the waters to free gas in the atmosphere, hence, the
increased CO2 levels. Warming causes CO2 elevation, not the other way around."
Not sure about his science---the earth gets warmer via perturbations in the earth's orbit/rotation...as explained earlier the upper atmosphere should
be warming first if this is a long term orbital phenomenon. Its not, the lower atmosphere is warming currently.
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dtbushpilot
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| Quote: Originally posted by rts551 | Dt you got thin skin man. Or in denial, and can't stand the question. Which is it?
A guy posts "Difficult to ID them because they are the silent majority. And they do not want publicity as I said before. Their studies and findings
are out there and not in the general public view. We only get snips if their findings and they contradict the reports that have the warming agenda to
publicize. "
And people ask for an explanation and you jump on your soap box. Let the someone explain what he means. Maybe its a secret society that has all the
answers. |
"Thin skin"? Me? you obviously don't know me and you must not have read what I wrote.
The discussion was going along fine until Paul made a comment that you and a few others didn't agree with. You chose to attack him first with your "Oh
yea? Prove it!" attitude then insulted him with the secret society MJ insult. Goat calls his opinion "hogwash, bezel calls it nonsense" and must have
swallowed too much Koch. Goat calls him (and includes me) pathetic while the whole group demands justification for his claim. Then you call me thin
skinned for making my comment and continue with your "secret society" joke. You are the only one who made secret society jokes, Paul never implied
that there was one.
Why do you want proof? You will just attack it as BS. Do your own research if you are really interested, my guess is you won't, your mind is already
made up and that's ok with me.
"Life is tough".....It's even tougher if you're stupid.....
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AKgringo
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DT, Some of us realize that you were not denying, or pushing a set of beliefs.
I thought you were just trying to chase the trolls back were they belong, so that others can still use the bridge for an exchange of ideas.
If you are not living on the edge, you are taking up too much space!
"Could do better if he tried!" Report card comments from most of my grade school teachers. Sadly, still true!
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dtbushpilot
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| Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo | DT, Some of us realize that you were not denying, or pushing a set of beliefs.
I thought you were just trying to chase the trolls back were they belong, so that others can still use the bridge for an exchange of ideas.
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Thank you AK, that was my intent, misguided as it may have been...
"Life is tough".....It's even tougher if you're stupid.....
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motoged
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DT is presently calling some scientists.....as well as dog-pilers....
Not thin-skinned at all, he presents his views as he sees 'em....
And he is optimistic.....as you can see he trusts his belt and doesn't think suspenders are needed  
Don't believe everything you think....
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rts551
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| Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot | | Quote: Originally posted by rts551 | Dt you got thin skin man. Or in denial, and can't stand the question. Which is it?
A guy posts "Difficult to ID them because they are the silent majority. And they do not want publicity as I said before. Their studies and findings
are out there and not in the general public view. We only get snips if their findings and they contradict the reports that have the warming agenda to
publicize. "
And people ask for an explanation and you jump on your soap box. Let the someone explain what he means. Maybe its a secret society that has all the
answers. |
If their findings are not
out there for the general public to view, how the hell am I supposed to find them?
"Thin skin"? Me? you obviously don't know me and you must not have read what I wrote.
The discussion was going along fine until Paul made a comment that you and a few others didn't agree with. You chose to attack him first with your "Oh
yea? Prove it!" attitude then insulted him with the secret society MJ insult. Goat calls his opinion "hogwash, bezel calls it nonsense" and must have
swallowed too much Koch. Goat calls him (and includes me) pathetic while the whole group demands justification for his claim. Then you call me thin
skinned for making my comment and continue with your "secret society" joke. You are the only one who made secret society jokes, Paul never implied
that there was one.
Why do you want proof? You will just attack it as BS. Do your own research if you are really interested, my guess is you won't, your mind is already
made up and that's ok with me.
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If their findings are not out there for the general public to view, how the hell am I supposed to find
them?
The discussion was going along fine as long as people agreed with you. I am open to facts. not just nay saying.
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rts551
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| Quote: Originally posted by motoged | DT is presently calling some scientists.....as well as dog-pilers....
Not thin-skinned at all, he presents his views as he sees 'em....
And he is optimistic.....as you can see he trusts his belt and doesn't think suspenders are needed |
I know. Its alright for him to insult. Geeze, I am not as optimistic....pull up your pants.
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DianaT
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I can only speak for myself, but I did not see Paul as expressing his opinion. It was a curious post that talked about silent hidden scientists.
That rather rings the bells of conspiracy.
No one can discuss their findings if they are secret. It does sound like an underground secret society. . Maybe it is not, but there has still been
no answer as how to find them and their research.
To espress an opinion is very different than saying there is secret research that for some reason is only available in snips.
Paul's opinion is his and that is fine. It is about those secret scientists and who they are,where are they,and what do they say.
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wessongroup
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What she said ^^ 
As for secret science ...
"We didn't come all this way for safety" ..
and that bike looks like a lot of fun ... eating my heart out 
[Edited on 7-24-2015 by wessongroup]
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bajacamper
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Now that's what I'm talking about. Makes perfect sense.
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Alm
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| Quote: Originally posted by rts551 | | I went out this morning and stuck a stick in the sand where the water comes up. This afternoon it did not reach it. Now I KNOW that you guys don't
know what you are talking about. Its a fact. |
It's not "us guys", but "them scientists". To question whether they know what they are talking about, requires an amount of knowledge and education
comparable to theirs.
There is such a word as "abrupt". Changes don't have to be (and in nature they rarely are) steady.
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Bajatripper
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| Quote: Originally posted by Mexitron |
Well, there was a suitable site called Yucca Mountain but folks got scared I guess. Might indeed find a use for the spent fuel someday.
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This is the reason why some of those who have looked at Yucca Mountain as a nuclear repository got scared:
Geology
The formation that makes up Yucca Mountain was created by several large eruptions from a caldera volcano and is composed of
alternating layers of ignimbrite (welded tuff), non-welded tuff, and semi-welded tuff. The tuff surround the burial sites is expected to protect human
health as it provides a natural barrier to the radiation. It lies along the transition between the Mohave and the Great Basin Deserts.
The volcanic tuff at Yucca Mountain is appreciably fractured and movement of water through an aquifer below the waste repository is primarily through
fractures. While the fractures are usually confined to individual layers of tuff, the faults extend from the planned storage area all the way to the
water table 600 to 1,500 ft (180 to 460 m) below the surface. Future water transport from the surface to waste containers is likely to be dominated by
fractures. There is evidence that surface water has been transported down through the 700 ft (210 m) of overburden to the exploratory tunnel at Yucca
Mountain in less than 50 years.
Some site opponents assert that, after the predicted containment failure of the waste containers, these cracks may provide a route for movement of
radioactive waste that dissolves in the water flowing downward from the desert surface. Officials state that the waste containers will be stored in
such a way as to minimize or even nearly eliminate this possibility.
The area around Yucca Mountain received much more rain in the geologic past and the water table was consequently much higher than it is today, though
well below the level of the repository.
Earthquakes
Nevada ranks fourth in the nation for current seismic activity. Earthquake databases (the Council of the National Seismic System Composite Catalogue
and the Southern Great Basin Seismic Network) provide current and historical earthquake information. Analysis of the available data in 1996
indicates that, since 1976, there have been 621 seismic events of magnitude greater than 2.5 within a 50-mile (80 km) radius of Yucca
Mountain.
DOE has stated that seismic and tectonic effects on the natural systems at Yucca Mountain will not significantly affect repository performance. Yucca
Mountain lies in a region of ongoing tectonic deformation, but the deformation rates are too slow to significantly affect the mountain during the
10,000-year regulatory compliance period. Rises in the water table caused by seismic activity would be, at most, a few tens of meters and would not
reach the repository. The fractured and faulted volcanic tuff that Yucca Mountain comprises reflects the occurrence of many earthquake-faulting and
strong ground motion events during the last several million years, and the hydrological characteristics of the rock would not be changed significantly
by seismic events that may occur in the next 10,000 years. The engineered barrier system components will reportedly provide substantial protection of
the waste from seepage water, even under severe seismic loading.
In September 2007, it was discovered that the Bow Ridge fault line ran underneath the facility, hundreds of feet east of where it was
originally thought to be located, beneath a storage pad where spent radioactive fuel canisters would be cooled before being sealed in a maze of
tunnels. (don't you just love these "experts"? And they think they are qualified to make 10,000-year predictions!) The discovery required
several structures to be moved several hundred feet further to the east, and drew criticism from Robert R. Loux, then head of the Nevada Agency for
Nuclear Projects, who argues that Yucca administrators should have known about the fault line's location years prior, and called the movement of the
structures “just-in-time engineering.” In June 2008, a major nuclear equipment supplier, Holtec International, criticized the Department of Energy's
safety plan for handling containers of radioactive waste before they are buried at the proposed Yucca Mountain dump. The concern is that, in an
earthquake, the unanchored casks of nuclear waste material awaiting burial at Yucca Mountain could be sent into a "chaotic melee of bouncing and
rolling juggernauts".
Probably not a good idea to put spent nuclear fuel with a who-knows-how-long half-life cycle in a volcanic area where it could be launched into the
atmosphere some day--to say nothing of the earthquakes coupled with the fractures that lead directly down to the water table...no matter what the
"experts" say about how safe containers might be built. We have some containers up here at the Hanford Nuclear Reserve that are slowly leaking their
radioactive waste into the Columbia River. The reason nobody can settle on a place to build a storage facility is that there just isn't a place that
is guaranteed not to be subjected to a natural disaster some day. Hence, they keep piling the spent fuel in "temporary storage."
[Edited on 7-25-2015 by Bajatripper]
There most certainly is but one side to every story: the TRUTH. Variations of it are nothing but lies.
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wessongroup
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Not sure why some get up set at a little flooding
Hell, there are a lot of place in the US and other places that are in "flood Plains"
DHS and/or FEMA in the US has a web site that tells how to become "certified" for Flood Insurance
http://www.fema.gov/media-library/assets/documents/160?id=13...
not sure who covers Tornados
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SFandH
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| Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot |
Do I think that scientific findings funded by the energy companies could be skewed by their personal agenda? Of course. The same holds true for
science funded by our government (who has an agenda of it's own) or any other source. It is naïve to assume otherwise in my opinion but if you don't
agree that's ok with me. |
It's clear to me why some scientists funded by the energy industry may present conclusions that are influenced by the energy
industry. That is, there is no man-made global warming.
What's not clear to me is why scientists all over the world funded by their respective governments would present conclusions that global warming, this
time, is man-made if they did not believe it to be true. What do the world governments have to gain by convincing people global warming is man-made if
it were not true?
In other words, what is the objective of this government agenda folks like PaulW are talking about?
[Edited on 7-25-2015 by SFandH]
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Timinator
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I can guarantee the top NASA Climate scientist as well as all 16 of his co-authors are as corrupt as corruption gets. They live for, and will supply
you with data to fit any scenario you can think of. It's about grants, contracts and most important of all, the "follow-up" contract. I worked for
them, they are immoral POS! Period.
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rts551
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| Quote: Originally posted by Timinator | | I can guarantee the top NASA Climate scientist as well as all 16 of his co-authors are as corrupt as corruption gets. They live for, and will supply
you with data to fit any scenario you can think of. It's about grants, contracts and most important of all, the "follow-up" contract. I worked for
them, they are immoral POS! Period. |
How about the rest of the world's scientists? The thought that 90% of the world's scientists are corrupt makes me wonder if the world is flat. Even
the Pope has some faith in science.
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Timinator
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| Quote: Originally posted by rts551 | | Quote: Originally posted by Timinator | | I can guarantee the top NASA Climate scientist as well as all 16 of his co-authors are as corrupt as corruption gets. They live for, and will supply
you with data to fit any scenario you can think of. It's about grants, contracts and most important of all, the "follow-up" contract. I worked for
them, they are immoral POS! Period. |
How about the rest of the world's scientists? The thought that 90% of the world's scientists are corrupt makes me wonder if the world is flat. Even
the Pope has some faith in science.
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How about the rest of the worlds scientists? They weren't part of the project and aren't privy to ANY of the original data or QA/QC data. They go by
what they've heard other people say. No different than you looking at a post here and replying. Real scientists don't jump on board ANYWHERE,
ANYHOW or ANYWAY like they do with this topic. There aren't that many qualified climate scientists to start with and most of them work work for the
Government or directly paid by Government projects. They must keep the money coming in or they're gone. On top of that, ALL the scientists working
for any Public agency aren't the best and brightest, they're the ones who couldn't get jobs in the private sector. That's just how it is.
Not to mention, Government projects on Climate are given to the lowest qualified bidder. That means despite having 60+% of the contract money going
to "overhead/accounting" to provide all the reporting CRAP the government requires, they have to cut every corner they can to get the data to begin
with.
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