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BajaNomad
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Ateo
Large areas where you could hide out/not be noticed. The possibilities are infinite. He could be anywhere.
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Remember, unless he's found another financial source, he's only working off whatever cash he took with him. If I recall correctly, the family
long-ago indicated they felt he could go quite a while camping on a remote beach. However his camping gear was apparently in the vehicle. So.....
When I was young, I admired clever people. Now that I am old, I admire kind people.
– Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel
We know we must go back if we live, and we don`t know why.
– John Steinbeck, Log from the Sea of Cortez
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absinvestor
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Ateo- my comment addressed to you and BajaGringo was in response to your comment on 4-11@416pm where you said "I believe Ron answered the Dr's
question when he said it is possible Gary hung out in that region for a few months just enjoying the remote location and surf etc." From your later
posts it is obvious that you were not agreeing with Ron but only clarifying to the Dr that Ron had already answered the Dr's question. My mistake for
including your name.
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Ateo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by absinvestor
Ateo- my comment addressed to you and BajaGringo was in response to your comment on 4-11@416pm where you said "I believe Ron answered the Dr's
question when he said it is possible Gary hung out in that region for a few months just enjoying the remote location and surf etc." From your later
posts it is obvious that you were not agreeing with Ron but only clarifying to the Dr that Ron had already answered the Dr's question. My mistake for
including your name. |
My mistake for not pushing the "quote" button on the Dr.'s post to better clarify what the heck I was saying. =)
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Taco de Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JoeJustJoe
Hook I would like to be enlightened about the Mexican cartel activity in Catavina which looks to be in the middle of nowhere in the Baja Hot Desert,
although I understand they have a nice motel , cave paintings, and rock formations. I understand there is Mexican cartel activity in many states and
towns in Mexico, and in certain areas of Baja, like Tijuana and Rosarito where the US State Department says to exercise caution especially when
traveling at night, and I'm really familiar with places in Tijuana where drugs sales are sometimes openly sold and then we have places like San
Lucas and La Paz where there is No advisory is in effect, and I'm pretty sure Catavina there would be no advisory in Catavina, and I can't even find
past news articles about Mexican cartel drug activity in Catavina. Now in San Quintin there are a few stories about cartel activity and a major farm
operation a few years back.
[Edited on 4-11-2014 by JoeJustJoe] |
A number of years ago there was a very large drug bust on the road a between El Rosario and Cataviña. It was only about a mile and a half north of
Hwy -1 (near KM 141). There was a 300 acre MJ growing operation at this location; to put that in perspective, that's almost a square mile in size!
The plowed field is even visible on Google Earth, it's fallow and brown but you can see it if you know where to look. The GE image likely predates
the entire 300 acre farm, but there is some plowing of less than 300 acres in evidence in the image.
Read about it here: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304521304576446441269265276
If you don’t trust my link, or want other sources, search for “Mexico’s largest marijuana farm”. It's tough finding sources to news article about
these remote areas because even the articles won’t name Cataviña by name since most people don't even know where that is. For example, most of the
articles on this 300 acre farm reference "El Rosario" as the location, although it's really closer to Cataviña. And I’ll bet many people won’t even
know the location of El Rosario. That "major farm operation” you mention is probably really this one in Cataviña, but the writer tossed in "San
Quintin" as more people might know where that is.
Also, not everything being transported by pangas and pickups in and out of these remote "fish camps" is fish. 
Sometimes being in the "middle of nowhere" is a good thing for the cartels.
[Edited on 4-11-2014 by Taco de Baja]
Truth generally lies in the coordination of antagonistic opinions
-Herbert Spencer
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vgabndo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JoeJustJoe
| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
| Quote: | Originally posted by mtgoat666
| Quote: | Originally posted by chuckie
Read the thread |
Where in the thread are cops cleared of being suspects?
If cops are not investigating, that makes me suspect they are involved in the disappearance.
If the cops are hiding information, at a same time they are not investigating,... You connect the dots.
Murder or disappearance is so rare in Catavina, makes me wonder why the cops are not out in force, communicating daily updates to family, etc
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On the subject of police complicity.........
Whatever police force is in Catavina is certainly inadequate to conduct a search this far from their main beat. And it would leave them unavailable to
continue their day-to-day operations, which has to be their first priority. Couple that with the logical conclusion that this person is very likely
dead, after all this time, and the priority in their mind becomes very low.
This investigation should be passed to authorities higher up than simply the municipal police, if it is simply a matter of manpower.
Of course it is possible that the local police are aware that there are drug operations in that area. Everyone knows that, except, apparently, Just
Joe. And they may feel that this gringo may have run afoul of them and they want no part of asking questions to persons within this organization
because they know they have to deal with them in the future. You know, as part of the uneasy "ignorance" that goes on all over Mexico between lower
cartel elements and local police. Ignorance born of payments to look the other way at the right time or born of the real fear of retribution. By now,
they may have contacted them and gotten an answer that basically says "do nothing" from them.
If Gary wandered into the wrong place at the wrong time, with respect to operations going on in the area, they may have known nothing about his
vehicle and valuables. They just wanted no witnesses, period.
I can't say how likely this scenarios are; probably the first one is more likely. But there has to be an explanation for why this isnt being pursued
faster. I can't understand why the family must be there to begin conducting a further search by authorities higher up than the locals.
[Edited on 4-11-2014 by Hook] |
Hook I would like to be enlightened about the Mexican cartel activity in Catavina which looks to be in the middle of nowhere in the Baja Hot Desert,
although I understand they have a nice motel , cave paintings, and rock formations. I understand there is Mexican cartel activity in many states and
towns in Mexico, and in certain areas of Baja, like Tijuana and Rosarito where the US State Department says to exercise caution especially when
traveling at night, and I'm really familiar with places in Tijuana where drugs sales are sometimes openly sold and then we have places like San
Lucas and La Paz where there is No advisory is in effect, and I'm pretty sure Catavina there would be no advisory in Catavina, and I can't even find
past news articles about Mexican cartel drug activity in Catavina. Now in San Quintin there are a few stories about cartel activity and a major farm
operation a few years back.
But according to numerous sources about 80 % to 90% of the homicides in Mexico involve Mexican cartel activity or involve drugs in some way. I don't
have the numbers in front of me, but gringo or American tourist getting killed in Mexico is really small and many of those that are killed die in
things such as car accidents, and sadly the few Americans citizens that are killed, are also sometimes tied in to selling or using drugs in Mexico.
So if Gary happened to stumble upon a cartel operation. Would it be such a big deal in a town with a part time cop? Why not pay off the cops? If
anything I would think Gary might have asked a drug runner for a Marijuana joint? Are you going to tell me that a 64 year old man who still surfs, is
on meds, and enjoys alcohol doesn't like the occasionally "mota" therapeutic relaxer?
If you're going to create a scenario where Gary was abducted or killed by Mexican cartel members because he may have stumbled on some clandestine drug
operation, or perhaps he refused to be a mule for the cartel. I would think in this case the more likely scenario based on past homicide stories in
the newspapers would be that Gary himself was up to his eyeballs with the Mexicans cartels, because really that would make more sense, however I don't
believe this either, and I believe Gary has a clean record in the USA, but don't ask me how I might know this.
I'm just amazed at all the finger pointing, when cases of missing persons go on all the time, and the places where people go missing in isolated
places. It's usually an accident caused in part by the victims lack of experience, not being property prepared, and sometimes just dumb luck.
[Edited on 4-11-2014 by JoeJustJoe] |
http://colectivopericu.net/2014/01/31/llegaron-los-caballero... They are in beautiful downtown Vizcaino.
And just today, the news... http://vizcainohoy.com/index.php/policiaca/item/4230-pgr-y-s...
[Edited on 4-11-2014 by vgabndo]
Undoubtedly, there are people who cannot afford to give the anchor of sanity even the slightest tug. Sam Harris
"The situation is far too dire for pessimism."
Bill Kauth
Carl Sagan said, "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself."
PEACE, LOVE AND FISH TACOS
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EnsenadaDr
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The obvious is: Gary was a talker, Gary was a nice guy. He loved people. He got involved with the wrong people.
Somebody in that very small community has to know what happened to him. The key is to find out who, where and why.
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
The obvious is: He got involved with the wrong people.
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Really??
ooops....Frank already voiced that sentiment....and more.
.
[Edited on 4-11-2014 by DENNIS]
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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msteve1014
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| Quote: | Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
The obvious is: He got involved with the wrong people.
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You are still just guessing, but stating things as if they were facts.
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Hook
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vgabundo, this isnt occuring in Catavina. It's towards the coast. Catavina apparently has jurisdiction over it but it closer to areas know for
smuggling operations.
You have looked at the maps indicating where the car was found, havent you?
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Taco de Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
The obvious is: He got involved with the wrong people.
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Really?? |
X2! 
Truth generally lies in the coordination of antagonistic opinions
-Herbert Spencer
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by msteve1014
| Quote: | Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
The obvious is: He got involved with the wrong people.
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You are still just guessing, but stating things as if they were facts. |
 It fits
well with the other 75 pages.
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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msteve1014
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Half of the guesses seem to come from Ensenada.
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durrelllrobert
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Spanish Direct translation of first article
The Knights Templar arrived BCS!
Posted on January 31, 2014| 78 comments
◾SE installed in the North Pacific
◾ esde December there are accounts in the site settings
◾Mataron to the former Chief of PLAZA de Vizcaíno
◾SE unleashes the hunt against LOS MICHOACANOS
◾Policia Ministerial and State police open front
2 1 templariosEl Vizcaino, B.C.S-Knights of new account heats the square in this region that includes all of the communities of the North Pacific area
and the city of Guerrero Negro, since now is the poster of the Knights TEMPLAR and intends to settle in Baja California Sur.
According to information published in its edition of the weekly newspaper ZETA and began to circulate as of today in the city of Tijuana, cells of
that cartel since December have been installed in VIZCAINO, who is now his base of operations for drug trafficking.
As you will be recalled, the past eight December was found the corpse of which identified as Chief of this place, identified as Iván Villavicencio
Arce "El Taco", which was executed to death with weapons caliber 45 and goat Horn.
Cites the publication since then a RAID of Knights TEMPLAR is being in the Northern Pacific, to seize 2 - 1 vizcaino henry froylanventa of drugs
through wrongfully that already gave the first clues about which now is has erected as the new head of square, identified with the nickname of the
BUZZARD and name Henry Froilan Rojas Ramirezoriginally from Apatzingan.
The data provided by wrongfully newly captured to those who know them as LOS MICHOACANOS, know that they are members of a cell of the Knights TEMPLAR
who infiltrated the region as agricultural workers, due to the pressure now exerted in their State of origin, part of the self-defense forces and the
Federal forces.
Concerns the weekly ZETA who already were captured by the police Ministerial Juan Carlos Casillas Ledesma of 24 years and Antonio Ledesma Moreno of 32
years, both originating in Apatzingan, situation that bothered much to the vulture who threatened via telephone to the headquarters of the Ministerial
police in VIZCAINO who release them "or will fall all dead".
Despite the threats, elements of the Attorney's special investigations of the Prosecutor's Office of Justice continue in search of Henry Froilan Rojas
Ramirez alias EL BUZZARD which already issued a warrant with photography. In the actions of intelligence and search also involved preventive State
police that has made screenshots of people involved in drug trafficking.
ASSURANCE OF WEAPONS AND DRUGS YESTERDAY!
The Attorney's special investigations unveiled as a result of operations carried out in the northern part of the State, were the location and 2 - 1
vizcaino narcomenudeoaseguramiento of long guns, 3 weapons short, 15 useful Chargers, 173 useful cartridges, seven vehicles, and Crystal and
granulated illicit substances with the characteristics of the drug Crystal corresponding to 31,750 doses, which are related to criminal acts in the
community of Villa Alberto Alvarado Arámburobeing placed at the disposal of the agent of the Ministry public jurisdiction common attached to the
Attorney's special investigations.
The State Ministerial police investigations agents attached to the Attorney's investigations special date 24, 25 and 26 of January of this year,
deployed operational special security in the community of Villa Alberto Alvarado Arámburo where was the arrest of 7 likely responsible for a crime
against the health and assurance of substances white and Crystal with the characteristics of the drug for a thousand glass 950 dosesas well as a white
powder with characteristics of 88 dose and a vehicle for cocaine, which were put at the disposal of the agent of the public prosecutor of the common
law research Adscritos to the strategic operations center in Guerrero Negro.
Derivative of the above was achieved at the same time the location of seven vehicles that are related to illegal activities in the area North Pacific
North State.
Tracking research on January 30, 2014, elements of the Ministerial State police assigned to the Attorney's research moved to the Ejido Gustavo Díaz
Ordaz, where was located next to the road that leads to Bahía Tortugas, buried 8 long and 3 short weapons and substance Crystal and grainy with the
characteristics of the drug Crystal, which is why the agent of the Ministry public of jurisdiction common researcher, ministerial police seconded to
the Attorney's special investigations and experts attached to the Directorate of services expert, Internat
Bob Durrell
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DENNIS
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So it's not a squeaky clean area. These guys in the drug business don't have a reputation for going around killing distressed people in the middle of
nowhere.
I'm not saying these thugs have any redeeming qualities, but they usually keep a tight focus on their traditional foes.
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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latina
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"Also, I'm not seeing any indication by anyone of the family's question (twice stated):
If Gary is still alive, where do you think he might be?
Thoughts?"
We know what he is NOT doing:
-not camping
-not surfing
-not fishing
-not taking photos
-not spending money
If he is alive someone would have to be looking after his necessities. The only places I come up with if he is alive are hospitals and jails.
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DENNIS
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| Quote: | Originally posted by latina
We know what he is NOT doing:
-not camping
-not surfing
-not fishing
-not taking photos
-not spending money
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Although I have to agree.......these are only more assumptions.
"YOU CAN'T LITTER ALUMINUM"
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KurtG
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The "major farm operation" a few years back was referred to as being in San Quintin by the news reports but in fact was just north of the highway at
San Agustin which is about 20 miles north of Catavina. Where the old closed Pemex and the unused SCT facility are. As to police operations in
Catavina, they are part-time and minimal at best and have existed at all only in fairly recent years.
About the only theory that hasn't been floated yet is that "Gottapeso" was the kingpin behind all this. That would make as much sense as most of the
speculation going on here.
[Edited on 4-12-2014 by KurtG]
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Skipjack Joe
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A couple of more suggestions for LL. Both are obvious:
Camera battery charge:
How much of a charge did the battery have when the police/rancher got hold of the camera. Assuming there is no way to charge batteries at those fish
camps and that he isn't using portable batteries, if the battery is close to full then he didn't spent 4 months at the Canoa fish camp.
Notes or writing:
Check vehicle/glove compartment for any notes, scribbles, writing that could have been left in the vehicle.
I suppose there could be many such clues now that I think about it. A salty wetsuit or swim trunks. Sand stuck to areas of wetsuit. If he perished
soon after crossing the border he probably never entered the water.
There must be many other clues like that. Booties? I don't know. I'm not a surfer.
Even the condition of his clothes. Check his clothes bag. If only a few are dirty then he didn't have time to go through them. If most look grungy
then he could have been at Canoa for 4 months. Compare clean vs dirty.
Will think about more such ideas.
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JoeJustJoe
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| Quote: | Originally posted by latina
"Also, I'm not seeing any indication by anyone of the family's question (twice stated):
If Gary is still alive, where do you think he might be?
Thoughts?"
We know what he is NOT doing:
-not camping
-not surfing
-not fishing
-not taking photos
-not spending money
If he is alive someone would have to be looking after his necessities. The only places I come up with if he is alive are hospitals and jails.
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The only hope Gary is still alive is early on it was mentioned somewhere on the Internet that Gary had a falling out with the family, had plenty of
money with him, and may not wanted to be found.
So this would bring up another question: Was Gary fond of the ladies? There are many older Gringos who find love with Mexican girls half their age,
and sometimes they find them in small towns and live quite happily for awhile at least till their money runs out, or for reasons why other people
split up, for example why their first wife divorced them . Could Gary be with some woman and her family and just be hiding out?
This is the only a plausible scenarios among the weird, outrageous, and unlikely I could think of, besides the most likely and obvious, and that is
Gary got stuck in the sand, left his two-wheel drive SUV, and went by foot to get help in the hot desert sun. I'm sorry, but it's highly unlikely
anybody could survive very long in those harsh unforgiving conditions in the Baja desert during the last days of summer in September.
[Edited on 4-12-2014 by JoeJustJoe]
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Skipjack Joe
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Fishing rods
I read that Gary was an ardent fisherman.
Were the rods assembled or disassembled?
If assembled then he probably fished on that coastline. Nobody leaves home with assembled rods. They are stowed and assembled after arrival. If rods
are unassembled he could or could not have been on the coast already. Sometimes we disassemble them when going from location to location, at other
times we just throw them over the back seat and keep them ready for other locations.
Can't think of other sure fire indicators of whereabouts regarding fishing. He could or could not have changed his line before the trip. Lures could
be new or battered - no clues there. Old bait on hooks could be an indicator of time spent at Canoa (4 month theory). Nobody leaves home with hooks in
that condition.
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