BajaNomad
Not logged in [Login - Register]

Go To Bottom
Printable Version  
Author: Subject: Baja California Indians
bajalera
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1875
Registered: 10-15-2003
Location: Santa Maria CA
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 09:51 AM
Baja California Indians


Excerpt from Brown Skins/Black Robes, a manuscript I'm working on [pardon the lack of accents]:

The bias in some early-day accounts of the Indians is not always obvious. For example, it's not unusual for a report to say that an exploring party consisted of "fifteen Spanianrds, some Indians, and eight mules." Spaniardsand mules were apparently considered worth country but Indians were not (although readers of Native American ancestry may be the only ones to recognize this as an insult).

Uncounted Indians, along with somewhat more obvious racism, appear in a letter written by the founder of the peninsula's first mission system, who reported that a road had been opened from Loreto toMission San Javier.

Nine soldiers and "some" friendly Indians--directed by a captain who had opened roads through rugged regions on the mainland, and accmpanied by a Jesuit--worked with picks, crowbars, axes and spades in widening a road that skirted towering cliffs and plunged into deep ravines.The area was strewn with so many sharp rocks that the men's shoes wore out and had to be resoled.

One day they came to a place where it was obvious that completing the project was going to take several months. While the men in charge were trying to figure out what to do, "an Indian from Vigge came and said it was more practical to make the road on the other side. Don Cristobal Guitierrez and soldier Melchor de Luna accompanied the Indian, and later in walking a little ways they found the trail, and on seeing it recognized the great advantage of opening the road through there in three days instead of three months."

Yes, Guitierrez and Luna "found the trail" and "recognized the great advantage" of the alternate route--after it had been pointed out to them by an Indian from Vigge. Knowing nothing of road-building, this man had watched the strangers at work, had visualized what they were trying to do, and was able to recognize another site as being a better place to do it.

As thought processes go, those of this unschooled engineer-without-portfolio were quite remarkable. So they baptized and Indian from Vigge, bestowing on him the name they deemed appropriate: Angel. For the problem he had solved was so complex that no mere mortal could have done this on his own. The man had obviously been sent to them by Divine Intervention from on high. (Although it seems fair to ask: If this problem-solver had been blessed with white skin, blonde hair and blue eyes, would God have found it necessary to butt in?




\"Very few things happen at the right time, and the rest never happen at all. The conscientious historian will correct these defects.\" - Mark Twain
View user's profile
Osprey
Ultra Nomad
*****




Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 10:10 AM


Lera, great stuff. In your research, did you run across any useful info on the Laimon or Monki Indians? I couldn't find much on them at all.
View user's profile
bajajudy
Elite Nomad
******


Avatar


Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 10:27 AM


Thanks, Lera
Muy interesante
Keep 'em coming




View user's profile
Gnome-ad
Nomad
**




Posts: 156
Registered: 6-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
Member Is Offline

Mood: Okey-Dokey

thumbup.gif posted on 9-26-2007 at 12:22 PM
Write on!


Thanks, Lera ~
I always find your writings about the Indians of Baja to be interesting and informative.
I am currently reading a history ("Memory of Fire" a trilogy by Eduardo Galeano) that also points out the many uncounted Indians everywhere in the Americas. The hubris of some of the “conquerors” is appalling. I’m grateful people like you are willing to wade through all the research required to bring these incidents to light these many years later. Keep up the great work!
:D

Edited to add name of trilogy

[Edited on 9-26-2007 by Gnome-ad]




The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well. - Ancis
View user's profile
Eli
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1471
Registered: 8-26-2003
Location: L.B. Baja Sur
Member Is Offline

Mood: Some times Observing, sometimes Oblivious.

[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 07:16 PM


Thanks Lee, I look forward to your perspectives, the only problem is they always leaving me wanting more. Hope, soon you will grace with another of your gems. Saludos, Sara
View user's profile
amir
Senior Nomad
***


Avatar


Posts: 559
Registered: 5-4-2007
Location: Todos Santos, BCS
Member Is Offline

Mood: chiropractic

[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 07:23 PM


Looking forward to the book... Thank you for teasing us with little stories like this one...
View user's profile Visit user's homepage
bacquito
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1615
Registered: 3-6-2007
Member Is Offline

Mood: jubilado

[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 07:44 PM


Maybe one of you-Bajalera,Osprey can help me out. How did the name of the town of Yuma come about? I have heard that it derived from humo (smoke) and other people simply don't know. Could it be that it derived from the ancient tribe of Baja indians collectively known as Yumanos?
The museum in Ensenada at the Riviera goes into some detail on the Baja indian tribes and it discusses the Yumanos.




bacquito
View user's profile
John M
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1910
Registered: 9-3-2003
Location: California High Desert
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-26-2007 at 08:28 PM
Name Yuma


Arizona Place Names by Will C. Barnes, revised in 1960 by Byrd Granger, page 366 provides this:

"There has been some confusion regarding the origin of the name Yuma. It seems probable that it does not, as has been suggested, reflect the title of a hereditary chief Yahmayo ("son of the captain"), but that the word Yuma derives from the habit this tribe had of making huge fires to induce rain, creating a trememdous amount of smoke in the process, and that their name in consequence comes from the Old Spanish word umo, meaning smoke."

In the event you wish more detail from Granger just ask, there are several additional paragraphs I can copy here for you.

John
View user's profile
bacquito
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1615
Registered: 3-6-2007
Member Is Offline

Mood: jubilado

[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 09:30 AM


Quote:
Originally posted by John M
Arizona Place Names by Will C. Barnes, revised in 1960 by Byrd Granger, page 366 provides this:

"There has been some confusion regarding the origin of the name Yuma. It seems probable that it does not, as has been suggested, reflect the title of a hereditary chief Yahmayo ("son of the captain"), but that the word Yuma derives from the habit this tribe had of making huge fires to induce rain, creating a trememdous amount of smoke in the process, and that their name in consequence comes from the Old Spanish word umo, meaning smoke."

In the event you wish more detail from Granger just ask, there are several additional paragraphs I can copy here for you.

John


Thanks




bacquito
View user's profile
Iflyfish
Ultra Nomad
*****




Posts: 3747
Registered: 10-17-2006
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 09:38 AM


Great stuff, keep it coming.

Iflyfish
View user's profile
bacquito
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1615
Registered: 3-6-2007
Member Is Offline

Mood: jubilado

[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 12:21 PM


As I recall my visit to the museum at the Riviera, the Yumanos were an ancient group of indigenous baja indians from which the Cocopahs in Yuma and other northern Baja tribes evolved. It seems logical that the name came from local tribes such as the Cocopahs.

The museum at the Riviera is worth visiting .

Thanks for the interest.




bacquito
View user's profile
shari
Select Nomad
*******


Avatar


Posts: 13039
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline

Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"

[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 01:55 PM


Have you heard anything about the race of "giants"...whose large bones were found around the gray whale sanctuary Ojo de Liebre near Guerrero Negro?



for info & pics of our little paradise & whale watching info
http://www.bahiaasuncion.com/
https://www.whalemagictours.com/
View user's profile Visit user's homepage
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64617
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 05:52 PM
11 foot human bones dug up 10 miles south of San Ignacio


Quote:
Originally posted by shari
Have you heard anything about the race of "giants"...whose large bones were found around the gray whale sanctuary Ojo de Liebre near Guerrero Negro?


Shari, the only place I recall reading about giants in Baja (other than Indian legends explaing how the cliffs were painted) was in Cliff Cross' 1974 edition of his Baja Guidebook...

Let me look it up and try and post the part of the page with that...

Okay, read 'Once Land of Giants?' just below the update note on San Ignacio (page 5-A of the '74 edition)...

(this may be interesting enough to post a new thread about?)

11 ft. man-aR.JPG - 48kB




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage
shari
Select Nomad
*******


Avatar


Posts: 13039
Registered: 3-10-2006
Location: bahia asuncion, baja sur
Member Is Offline

Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"

[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 06:22 PM


WEll I didn't read this but it is one of those campfire stories told to me by the locals there...but there was trade and contact between san ignacio and these parts so sound like the giants did exist around here....cool! Our house sits on a once well used obsidian tool making shop...there are chips everywhere around here and I've found some nice little complete arrowheads too as have visiting kids...neato eh.



for info & pics of our little paradise & whale watching info
http://www.bahiaasuncion.com/
https://www.whalemagictours.com/
View user's profile Visit user's homepage
Osprey
Ultra Nomad
*****




Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 06:49 PM


The giant bone turned out to be a rib bone of a camelid, ancient camels which once roamed this area. The first was found south of San Ignacio and since then several others have been found, verified and age-dated.
View user's profile
bajalera
Super Nomad
****




Posts: 1875
Registered: 10-15-2003
Location: Santa Maria CA
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-27-2007 at 06:50 PM


Good question Jorge, but I haven't got an answer. Didiu and Monqui both seem to have disappeared early on. Jesuit Miguel del Barco, who arrived around 1730, said he had never heard this word used on the peninsula, although he had read it in reports. Somewhere I've read that Concho, the site of Loreto, was a Monqui village.

Everyone else: Thanks for the encouragement.

Does anybody think God should be lending a hand instead of butting in [which is probably a sacrilege]?




\"Very few things happen at the right time, and the rest never happen at all. The conscientious historian will correct these defects.\" - Mark Twain
View user's profile
bajabum
Nomad
**




Posts: 144
Registered: 9-29-2003
Location: San Diego, Ca
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 9-28-2007 at 09:39 AM


A few years back I went on an Indian cave painting tour in Mulege. The guide was a gringo named Carey who used to own the El Candil resteraunt (looked kinda like Santa Claus). It was a full day trip that started off with a 4 wheel drive trip out to a ranch. Then a 2-3 mile hike to a river where we swam another mile or so. The river was like a miniature grand canyon and must have been spring fed because it was kinda cold. We then visited several cave painting sites and I remember him saying something about the Cuchimi Indians who were supposed to have been giants...7-8 feet tall. Dont know weather that was true or not but the history of their anual migrations from the Pacific to the Cortez at different times of the year foraging for food delicacies from cactus fruits to scallops and fish was very interesting. Finished the day back at the ranch for a home cooked lunch and cold Coronas. Very cool adventure.



Work is just something I do to keep me buzy between baja trips!
View user's profile
David K
Honored Nomad
*********


Avatar


Posts: 64617
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline

Mood: Have Baja Fever

[*] posted on 9-28-2007 at 03:30 PM


Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
The giant bone turned out to be a rib bone of a camelid, ancient camels which once roamed this area. The first was found south of San Ignacio and since then several others have been found, verified and age-dated.


Thanks!!! It's nice to have some closure on these old reports...

I still want to know what happened to all the condors on Diablo Mountain the Sierra Club reported in 1970!?? Newer stories say the last condor in Baja died in 1936 or thereabouts... ??? another thread topic for sure!




"So Much Baja, So Little Time..."

See the NEW www.VivaBaja.com for maps, travel articles, links, trip photos, and more!
Baja Missions and History On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
Camping, off-roading, Viva Baja discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/vivabaja


View user's profile Visit user's homepage

  Go To Top

 






All Content Copyright 1997- Q87 International; All Rights Reserved.
Powered by XMB; XMB Forum Software © 2001-2014 The XMB Group






"If it were lush and rich, one could understand the pull, but it is fierce and hostile and sullen. The stone mountains pile up to the sky and there is little fresh water. But we know we must go back if we live, and we don't know why." - Steinbeck, Log from the Sea of Cortez

 

"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care." - Theodore Roosevelt

 

"You can easily judge the character of others by how they treat those who they think can do nothing for them or to them." - Malcolm Forbes

 

"Let others lead small lives, but not you. Let others argue over small things, but not you. Let others cry over small hurts, but not you. Let others leave their future in someone else's hands, but not you." - Jim Rohn

 

"The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer." - Cunningham's Law







Thank you to Baja Bound Mexico Insurance Services for your long-term support of the BajaNomad.com Forums site.







Emergency Baja Contacts Include:

Desert Hawks; El Rosario-based ambulance transport; Emergency #: (616) 103-0262