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Marie-Rose
Senior Nomad
Posts: 894
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: Victoria, B.C. and Todos Santos
Member Is Offline
Mood: Worried...
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I really cannot do any more spay and neuter clinics!!
Day 3 of a 4 day spay and neuter clinic and I am alaready in big trouble!!! Perra number 4(actually she had #76 ttaped to her little head most of the
day) is sleeping at my feet and I am wondering if I am in fact loosing my mind
I knew I was in trouble on Tues when I went to get our car from the local mechanic who had several dogs tied up on short leads, and the lovely little
mama who was tied to the bumber of a car so that her 3 little pups could nurse from her starving body. Her tail was wagging so hard that it almost
knocked her over!! I knew I was in trouble!!
In my broken spanish I told the man about the free spay and neuter clinic and he said he he would let me come and get the dogs... he also had 5 cats
and... he really did not want the mama and her pups. She was a dog that just showed up at his home. ( now I knew I was really in trouble!!)
True to his word ( well almost, he had one male he would not have neutered) he let us take all of his pets and our local "puupy recyclers" took the
puppiess who, although a bit young, were ready to leave their starving mama.
Even while mama was terriefied in the plastic carrier, waiting for the surgery, I could hear her tail wagging against the carrier. I kept
saying..."just don't look at her!" Didn't work... here she lays at my feet. The cuttest little face you ever did see. No more puppies for this
little mama. I hope I can find her a good home!!!
Remember, when in Mexico, yes may be no and no may be
maybe!
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salvavida
Junior Nomad
Posts: 29
Registered: 10-29-2007
Member Is Offline
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Good for you Marie-rose. Even if you cant do any more, your soul will be richer for what you have done. I believe animals deserve all we can do for
them for all they do for us.
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djh
Senior Nomad
Posts: 936
Registered: 1-2-2005
Location: Earth mostly. Loreto, N. ID, Big Island
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mellow fellow, plays a yellow cello...
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Bless your heart !!!
One word for you:
 SAINT !
djh
Its all just stuff and some numbers.
A day spent sailing isn\'t deducted from one\'s life.
Peace, Love, and Music
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DrTom
Nomad
Posts: 183
Registered: 6-17-2007
Member Is Offline
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Was that the RAVS clinic at CARE in San Jose? Howd it go?
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tortuga
Nomad
Posts: 277
Registered: 8-11-2007
Location: Bellevue, Idaho or Los Barriles B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
Mood: Muy Despacio
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THANK YOU
as much as we love Baja it always tears our hearts when we see the mistreated animals . Thank you very much for your efforts . Tu eres
Tortuga
[Edited on 11-10-2007 by tortuga]
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rhintransit
Super Nomad
Posts: 1588
Registered: 9-4-2006
Location: Loreto
Member Is Offline
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my heart goes out to your heart, and the animals who have no other champions. and so I too begin another seaon of volunteering at my local
Animalandia clinic, firm in the knowledge that I cannot take an animal into my life at this time but it is SO hard. I figure a little kindness and
freedom from constant reproduction is the best I can give right now.
and for those of you in the Loreto driving area...another big spay/neuter clinic here Dec 3,4,5,6,7 coming up. bring them in. we do what we can.
reality\'s never been of much use out here...
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Minnow
Banned
Posts: 1110
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: Lost Wages
Member Is Offline
Mood: Embarrased Harry Reid is a Nevadan
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I salute all you fellow animal lovers. Marie, I understand how you feel, when those puppy eyes meet our own, it makes it hard to not want to take
them all in. Do not worry if you can't, your good deeds help so many. You will never know all the puppies you have helped, and that is a good thing.
Saludos again.
Why is it that Mexicans think there is something wrong with neutering the males? Don't they understand they are half the problem?
Proud husband of a legal immigrant.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Minnow
Why is it that Mexicans think there is something wrong with neutering the males? Don't they understand they are half the problem?
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I've heard them say that it's "unnatural." Don't think that didn't get me started.
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jburks572
Newbie
Posts: 1
Registered: 11-8-2007
Member Is Offline
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Dogs
The Mexicans in general do not treat dogs well. They deliberately run them down on the roads and will even swerve off the road to kill them. It is a
cultural disgrace. Many do not even feed their dogs but leave them to eat offal and garbage. They poison them for fun. Now before all of you with
blinders on jump forward to give the case of people who love their dogs, let me say that there are dog lovers in the population but they are a small
minority. The dog haters in Mexico are not typical of all Latin countries and it is not a problem of poverty it is a problem of evil hearts. To pick
one Latin country, look at Peru. They love their dogs and honor them as they should be honored. It is not a question of poverty. The Peruvians are
poorer than the mexicans. Every dog abuser should recieve the same. Dogs and ourselves are co-evolved. We would not be who we are if it were not
for dogs. May all dog abusers burn in Hell.
JB
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
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It is.
| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
I've heard them say that it's "unnatural." Don't think that didn't get me started. |
And a cure-all for the irresponsible pet owner. Society would be better served if these people weren't allowed to own pets.
I understand the necessity for spay/neuter. I support it, reluctantly.
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Minnow
Banned
Posts: 1110
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: Lost Wages
Member Is Offline
Mood: Embarrased Harry Reid is a Nevadan
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Ever heard of the cultural phenomenon of Mexicans putting a mean dog on their roof?  they think it makes them look tough.
Proud husband of a legal immigrant.
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bajabound2005
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2760
Registered: 10-15-2005
Location: Punta Banda, BCN
Member Is Offline
Mood: words cannot describe...
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Marie-Rose, thanks for your good work. We did a clinic here in Punta Banda last Spring. Ran into the same problem with a Mexican woman who had 40+
dogs; she'd let us take the females but did not want us to take the males to have neutered. This is when only women were talking to her. Then we had
a male vet speak with her -- and whatever he told her, it worked. She let us take all the males and have them neutered. Can't say that this would
have worked had she been a man, but it worked with her!
Keep up the good work
Friends don't let friends drink white zinfandel.
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docsmom
Nomad
Posts: 418
Registered: 6-21-2007
Location: Tucson, AZ
Member Is Offline
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Marie-Rose,
That little girl sitting at your feet thanks you for your kindness and so do I. I think maybe you've already found her good home 
Whether you keep her or you find her a family, she's found an angel in you!
Every time I'm in Baja my heart is broken by the ill treated and abandoned dogs. I used to befriend and feed them and scheme to bring all of them
home. But since I can't bring them home I started to wonder if I was doing them good or harm. So now I'm attached in my behavior, but not my
emotions. It isn't easy.
I'm 400 miles from the border and can't make a daily difference so I did the only thing I could find to do. I do most of my daily shopping at
Albertsons and learned that they have a charitible entity where a percentage of my purchases go to the charity that I choose. There are limits
they'll pay to any given charity but I've declared my portion to go to the Rosarito Animal Shelter. I don't know anything about the Rosarito Animal
Shelter, and I know all shelters aren't good. I hope I don't get blasted here if it's not a good organization..... I'd like to hear others
suggestions.
But back to my comment to you Marie-Rose....
I felt the pain in your post. You're a love for giving in spite of the pain! When I finally get to Baja permanently I'll be standing beside you and
we'll work to eliminate the over-population and get the babies families!
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Minnow
Banned
Posts: 1110
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: Lost Wages
Member Is Offline
Mood: Embarrased Harry Reid is a Nevadan
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Docsmom, There is an organization in Northern Baja called" Give some Life". They do low cost and no cost spay and neuter clinics from TJ to El
Rosario, and beyond. It is the same one that Cyndarough, BB05, Paulina, BajaCactus, and a few others here, help out with. They would love to have
your support. I am sure BB05 can give you all the contact info. This also goes to anyone else who would like to help out with the pet overpopulation
in Baja.
Proud husband of a legal immigrant.
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DrTom
Nomad
Posts: 183
Registered: 6-17-2007
Member Is Offline
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From a pet population/epidemiology perspective. The most effective effort in population program is spay females. Doesnt matter how many intact males
there are if there is not enough females to breed, BUT all it takes is a few males and a bunch of females get bred. So if you want to end pet
overpopulation, spay females. When they come out with a practical sterilization injection for females the problem will go away. Until then, we spay.
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vandenberg
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5118
Registered: 6-21-2005
Location: Nopolo
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DrTom
BUT all it takes is a few males and a bunch of females get bred. So if you want to end pet overpopulation, spay . |
Isn't that a kind of contradiction.
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bajabound2005
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2760
Registered: 10-15-2005
Location: Punta Banda, BCN
Member Is Offline
Mood: words cannot describe...
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http://www.givesomelife.org/index.html
Friends don't let friends drink white zinfandel.
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Marie-Rose
Senior Nomad
Posts: 894
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: Victoria, B.C. and Todos Santos
Member Is Offline
Mood: Worried...
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Thank you for all the fabulous comments... really what I do is very little compared to the saints that volunteer around here. And don't even let me
get started about the fabulous people from Ravs (Yes, Dr. Tom...) Dr. Susan was just incredible.
The clinic went well, the last day was yesterday. We had several local vets who also came to work. Dr. Tom, I believe your freind from San Jose was
here and I unfortunately cannot remember his name. Lovely man.
There were some incredible moments. One particularly nasty rattle snake bite. A lovely young lady lost her cat on the operating table and she pulled
hersellf together and then proceeded to insisit on bringing this dog (who had been bitten), in terrible shape, and drove it to La Paz. Apperently the
smell of rotting flesh was horrible. The owner of La Canada and others, quickly gathered enough money to pay for initial treatment in La Paz and the
Mexican family who were the owners, were tearfully grateful.
Little mamasita is lying on her bed at my feet as I type. She is such a sweetie. Has not done much but sleep and eat. She is still very scarred and
does not want to be picked up... She has not had one accident in the house despite some nasty diarrhea. Hopefully she will be ready tomorrow for the
task of getting her diagnosed for erlichea and heartworm and then I can proceed to trying to find her a home. I believe she is small enough to go
into a carrying case. She would be perfect for an owner who has limited space and I do not think will require much more than love.
I think I also need to mention that although the Mexicans need to go a long way in taking care of their animals, this is my 3rd clinic and there
always seem to be more locals bringing their pets in and this is a good thing. Poco a poco.
Another thing I need to mention is my comment about the "puppy recyclers"... said in the most loving way. wrk is a fellow nomad and she and her
husband have had (I am sure) over a 100 puppies go thru their home. They are much more than "puppy recyclers" 
Remember, when in Mexico, yes may be no and no may be
maybe!
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DrTom
Nomad
Posts: 183
Registered: 6-17-2007
Member Is Offline
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Good to hear the clinic went well, the doctor who donates the clinic in San Jose is Dr Jorge Bravo, he is the one who coordinates with Dr Susan Monger
( who works for the Rural Area Veterinary Service, part of the humane society in the US) and the other vets in the local area (who like Dr Bravo,
donate their time) to run the spay program out of the hospital in San Jose.
Answer to the sterilization question: anything that prevents sperm from being delivered is sterilization in a male. So castration or vasectomy
suffice. Vasectomies not practical in dogs usually, because most owners prefer the reduction of marking, aggression, prostate issues, etc that come
along with the castration. and actually castration is easier. Spays more expensive because an internal abdominal surgery/more difficult than a neuter
or vasectomy.
Sometimes the "spay females" conversation is not clear, sometimes because its wondered if human philosophy is implicated like "male bias" etc. but
its not. Imagine if all the female dogs in the world were spayed but one and none of the males were castrated. All youd ever have to do is spay the
female offspring from that one mother we've allowed to breed and youd never have a significant increase in the pet population. Now consider the other
way around. All the males are castrated but one, and we allow him to breed and all the females can breed. Now you have to manage all the offspring
from the total of the females that one male comes in contact with. And surprisingly enough, some of these males can be pretty ambitious.
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DrTom
Nomad
Posts: 183
Registered: 6-17-2007
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by lencho
| Quote: | Originally posted by DrTom
Vasectomies not practical in dogs usually, because most owners prefer the reduction of marking, aggression, prostate issues, etc that come along with
the castration. |
Interesting. What are the prostate issues?
Will a b-tch normally permit more than one male to mate with her? If we vasectomized the dominant males in an area and let them roam around doing
their thing, I'm curious whether the reproduction rate would drop...
--Larry |
A female will mate with multiple males. So theoretically you can have a litter of 8 each with a different father. It all depends on whos sperm is the
most able to penetrate the ova coming down the fallopian tubes......ie early bird gets the worm, or ova in this case. Vas's on dominant males wouldnt
help, cause the less dominant males would breed the females while the dominant's were having a smoke.
Testosterone supports the prostate and drives: prostatic hypertrophy, prostatic cancer, and if theres a prostate it can get infected. So neutering
reduces/eliminates: cancer, hypertrophy and infection.....all life threatening issue.... Im suprised neutering hasnt caught on with humans, cause it
would eliminate prostate cancer in men  
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