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Russ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6742
Registered: 7-4-2004
Location: Punta Chivato
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Plastic bags?
What do you Think?
http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/08/19/mexico.plastic....
Bahia Concepcion where life starts...given a chance!
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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It's a good idea, those things are a scourge.
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dianaji
Senior Nomad
Posts: 606
Registered: 8-12-2008
Location: San Marcos, CA
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Mood: hungry for knowledge, simplicity, hugs and fish tacos!
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i think it's one of the best ideas i have heard of in a long time. it's fun to go to the farmer's market with a basket on your arm and fill it with
vegetables/fruits. i love telling the vendors "no thanks, i'll just put them in my basket".
diana
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baitcast
Super Nomad
Posts: 1785
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: kingman AZ.
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Mood: good
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Hate those things with a passion,the sooner the WORLD gets rid of them the better,and what an eye-sore!!
Rob
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
Location: La Paz / Bahia Asunci�n / Away from home
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While there is no doubt in my mind about plastic bags being a huge source of litter and an eyesore, I am always turned off when reading an article
that cites false information when trying to bolster it's argument.
| Quote: |
In recent years, polyethylene bags, usually made from petroleum or natural gas, have largely displaced the more cumbersome paper sack as a means of
carrying items from the store to the home or office. But their ubiquitous presence has drawn the ire of environmental activists and politicians who
claim the bags inflict significant harm on the environment, including causing the death of 100,000 mammals and one million seabirds annually.
The plastic bag scare, it turns out, is based on a 1987 Canadian study that investigated the harm to marine mammals and seabirds from discarded fish
nets. For reasons not fully understood, Australian researchers, in a follow-up study conducted 15 years later, mistakenly attributed the death of
100,000 marine animals to plastic bags instead of the "plastic litter" cited in the Canadian research.
"Plastic bags do not figure in entanglement. The main culprits are fishing gear, ropes, lines, and strapping bands," David W. Laist, an analyst with
the U.S. Marine Mammal Commission, told the March 8 Times of London.
"Most mammals are too big to get caught up in a plastic bag," Laist continued. "The impact of bags on whales, dolphins, porpoises, and seals ranges
from nil for most species to very minor for a few species. For birds, plastic bags are not a problem either."
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We've sold re-usable bags through our website for over a decade now and you can buy cloth bags in just about every grocery store in the U.S. Most
people do not use them because paper and plastic bags are easier.
The argument of paper versus plastic is also problematic.
| Quote: |
Angela Logomasini, director of risk studies at the Washington-based Competitive Enterprise Institute, says such rhetoric is far off the mark.
"In our energy-conscious age, the attack on plastic bags is perplexing," Logomasini said. "Plastic bags have beat out paper bags in the marketplace
because they are not only easier to carry and easier to store and transport, but also because they have important environmental benefits that also
make them less expensive."
"For example," Logomasini noted, "studies have shown that plastic bags require 40 percent less energy to make than paper bags, and they produce only 4
percent of the waste that paper produces. And if you are worried about carbon emissions, plastic bags produce 60 percent less 'greenhouse gases.'"
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[Edited on 8-21-2009 by BMG]
I think the world is run by C- students.
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mulegemichael
Super Nomad
Posts: 2310
Registered: 12-24-2007
Location: sequim,wa. and mulege
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Mood: up on step
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There is no justification for plastic bags...none...how many do you see stuck high in a cardon cactus or flapping in the wind along a barb wire
fence...there ARE other alternatives..plastic has got to go!
dyslexia is never having to say you\'re yrros.
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oldjack
Nomad
Posts: 350
Registered: 1-26-2006
Location: Los Barriles
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Mood: retired
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anytime plastic bags are mentioned/seen I am reminded of that long stretch of highway by Catavina where ALL the brush is covered by plastic bags... I
should have taken a picture... next trip in two weeks I will then...
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
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Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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MEXICAN Plastic Bags
Maybe it's a result of differences in Atmospheric Pressure at different Latitudes or some other esoteric scientific phenomenon, but the widespread
proliferation of Plastic Bags on the landscape seems most probematic South of the U.S. border.
It's rather amazing that the Wind currents and other natural patterns have an awareness and are affected by civil determinations.
Another of those FM Factors ?
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Crusoe
Senior Nomad
Posts: 731
Registered: 10-14-2006
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Here in King Co., ( Seattle Wa.) an inniative to completely get rid plastic bags was voted out 2 days ago. The plastic bag manafactures pumped
millions of $ in local advertising to brainwash the public that they are ok.... 95% of the advertising was pro bags and 5% was against. The
environmentalist, liberals didn't stand a chance. And this city is supposed to be the largest "ECO FRIENDLY" stronghold in the nation?? Go figure....
To bad. ++C++
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woody with a view
PITA Nomad
Posts: 15939
Registered: 11-8-2004
Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
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Mood: Everchangin'
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but what would dog walkers use to scoop their pooches poop with?
edit: oh wait, we're talking baja now....
[Edited on 8-20-2009 by woody in ob]
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Pompano
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8194
Registered: 11-14-2004
Location: Bay of Conception and Up North
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Mood: Optimistic
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On the positive side....ahem...Enough of them blowing around Baja always looks festive, like snow at Christmas Up North. 
I do what the voices in my tackle box tell me.
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oldlady
Banned
Posts: 1714
Registered: 10-31-2005
Location: BCS
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Hmmm. BMG's post says that overall they are better for the enviornment.
I like them because they are much easier to carry and I reuse them for all sorts of things. So, there seems to be an issues with these puppies
"running away". When I was a kid I can remember paper bags running away a lot too. Spme pf us learned to pick them up.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9011
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Mood: Inquisitive
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So, what would I line by bathroom and kitchen trash cans with? For that matter, what replaces my Hefty bags in the outside trash?
Would I be relegated to washing out my trash cans each time? 
I thought there was some biodegradable option that was similar to plastic.
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DianaT
Select Nomad
Posts: 10020
Registered: 12-17-2004
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We reuse plastic bags for lots of things, but I would still LOVE to see them gone.
But then again, I would also like to see disposable diapers banned from the world and I know there are arguments that support those horrible things
that are also far too often decorating the landscape.
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Heather
Nomad
Posts: 370
Registered: 10-31-2002
Location: National City, CA
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Plastics which we are using now, are not biodegradable. Plastics can get broken down, but just into smaller pieces or the components that make them.
Besides in the Baja cactus, many find there way to the open ocean.
I've been following a research vessel from Scripps La Jolla, that has been studying plastics in the North Pacific Gyre...North Pacific Garbage Patch.
They are returning from their research voyage, but in every sample of the water, they pulled up pieces of plastic. Some large; some measured in
millimeters; and some going to depths of 700+ feet.
I'm glad some communities are taking measures to reduce the distribution of plastic. Much more needs to be done.
The scientists on this research voyage, don't sound very optimistic about ways to get the plastics out of our oceans, but we can always hope and keep
doing the science!
Check out the website for pictures and follow the blog:
www.seaplexscience.com
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
Location: La Paz / Bahia Asunci�n / Away from home
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Hook
I thought there was some biodegradable option that was similar to plastic. |
They do make biodegradable
bags, just more money.
bags
[Edited on 8-20-2009 by BMG]
I think the world is run by C- students.
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Bwana_John
Nomad
Posts: 294
Registered: 10-17-2007
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I always look at plastic shopping bags and toilet paper in Baja as kinda "Mexican version of Tibetan prayer flags"
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
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Hmmmm.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 65289
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Perhaps if people would not throw them out into the countryside and instead burn them (like all trash was treated before)... then the talk of banning
a popular and useful item wouldn't be happening...?
Can't people become responsible and stop throwing things into the desert for someone else to deal with or look at?
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
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Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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Why is it ?
That the Plastic grocery bags I save and store in the garage for future use end up disintegrating after awhile in the heat, BUT the ones Permanently
out in the sun littering the Mexican countryside seem to last forever ?
Since so many people seem determined to see them gone, I guess that I'll have to start stocking up on the commercial trash bags in various sizes along
with the incandescent light bulbs I'm stockpiling. What next ?
The last two trips to Walmart, I've bought more light bulbs (premium 4 for $1.66) and my wife said "Don't we have ENOUGH of these" ? My answer was
"Do we EVER have enough" ?
Oh, speaking of what's next, SUGAR ! Now I find out there's going to be a shortage of THAT. Just bought two extra 5-pound bags and
Rubbermaids to store them in.
NOW, I have to start on Trash Bags.
Manana.
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