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monoloco
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Orcas Attacking a Fin Whale In Bahia de La Paz
Amazing video:
http://youtu.be/3HmDmqLl6WA
"The future ain't what it used to be"
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mtgoat666
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the charter boat operator was following whales too close,... In one scene you can see fresh propeller scar on fin whales back. Fin whale was probably
already stressed out, boat chasing whale probably did not help his stress level, eh?
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monoloco
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I agree, charter boats often get too close. I've seen 5 or 6 boats at a time harassing gray whales off Cabo trying to jockey for a good viewing
position.
"The future ain't what it used to be"
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Bajahowodd
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I have always been dismayed by the love of the Orca. It is the singular whale that eats flesh, i.e. other whales. My wonderful friends, the California
Grey whale adapted to this truth by finding safe venues to reproduce and birth.
At Laguna Ojo de Liebre, the fact that it is relatively shallow makes it a safe haven. Orcas, by nature, dive deep to enable them to have the speed
with which they attack their prey. They cannot do that in Liebre.
So, it has often saddened me that while I'm having this "high" as I'm petting these beautiful creatures in the lagoon, I fear for them as they exit.
Sadly, often, the orcas wait outside and attack the calves when they leave on their trek North with their mothers.
I really hate Sea World because they canonize the cannibal Orcas with plaques and t-shirts and even license plate frames that proclaim "I love Orcas".
Sadly, the Orca appears to be the "prettiest" of the whale family, and are easily trained.
But, I do not love Orcas.
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Mexitron
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Life feeds on life---is it any less despicable than a pack of wolves taking down a bison or a lion taking out a water buffalo? or for that matter a
pet dog eating a squirrel? I don't "like" it either but it seems to be the way the world is. The whales were fine, all things considered, until we
decimated their numbers, far more damage than the orcas have ever done.
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Whale-ista
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Orcas, Sea World and "Blackfish" documentary
Sea World "trains" orcas by starving them, isolating them from other whales, and denying them food until they perform the desired behavior. I don't
consider that training, I consider it torture.
They also use captive breeding and then remove young whales from the mother a few weeks after birth, long before they would naturally separate. Anyone
who has observed the close, tactile relationship of gray whales in the Baja lagoons would know how abnormal this is.
I'm a native San Diegan who gave up on sea world many years ago after watching clearly psychotic behavior on display by large intelligent marine
mammals locked in tiny aquariums. It was too disturbing to see these animals in captivity.
I'll pay money to travel to see them in the lagoons or offshore, but never again in tanks.
The new documentary highlights the behavior of an orca that has now killed 3 trainers. Sea World is working hard to disprove the Information. Search
for "Blackfish" for more details but be forewarned, it is gruesome.
\"Probably the airplanes will bring week-enders from Los Angeles before long, and the beautiful poor bedraggled old town will bloom with a
Floridian ugliness.\" (John Steinbeck, 1940, discussing the future of La Paz, BCS, Mexico)
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Mexitron
Life feeds on life---is it any less despicable than a pack of wolves taking down a bison or a lion taking out a water buffalo? or for that matter a
pet dog eating a squirrel? I don't "like" it either but it seems to be the way the world is. The whales were fine, all things considered, until we
decimated their numbers, far more damage than the orcas have ever done. |
Yes, nature is not always a pretty thing to watch. It can be so difficult to watch not only predator taking down prey, but the internal battles among
predators, like a wolf pack killing a former alpha female because there is a new alpha.
But as you point out in the example of the whales, there is one animal on this planet who dominates in the area of destroying other species for
economic or simply sport reasons.
Whale-ista, I dislike Sea World for those reasons. I always hated zoos, even as a child. I hated to see the animals caged. Admittedly, it is a bit
different in some places where only orphaned or injured animals are taken in and the zoos participate in saving species, for instance the California
Condor.
[Edited on 7-31-2013 by DianaT]
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Barry A.
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DianaT
| Quote: | Originally posted by Mexitron
Life feeds on life---is it any less despicable than a pack of wolves taking down a bison or a lion taking out a water buffalo? or for that matter a
pet dog eating a squirrel? I don't "like" it either but it seems to be the way the world is. The whales were fine, all things considered, until we
decimated their numbers, far more damage than the orcas have ever done. |
Yes, nature is not always a pretty thing to watch. It can be so difficult to watch not only predator taking down prey, but the internal battles among
predators, like a wolf pack killing a former alpha female because there is a new alpha.
But as you point out in the example of the whales, there is one animal on this planet who dominates in the area of destroying other species for
economic or simply sport reasons, even in the case of humans against humans. Some predators live on this forum.
Whale-ista, I dislike Sea World for those reasons. I always hated zoos, even as a child. I hated to see the animals caged. Admittedly, it is a bit
different in some places where only orphaned or injured animals are taken in and the zoos participate in saving species, for instance the California
Condor.
[Edited on 7-28-2013 by DianaT] |
I agree. My sister Lived right across from "Sea World" for years, and never attended for the reasons you all state, and I never did either. Ditto
for the San Diego Zoo, one of the best in the world, but it disturbs me greatly to be there, as does the Monterey Aquarium--------My kids feel the
same way, tho undoubtably influenced by me..
Its all very unsettleing. We do hunt birds and deer, and fish, occasionally-------but even that is somewhat disturbing to me, and I almost never do
even that anymore.
Barry
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Mexitron
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Whale-ista
Sea World "trains" orcas by starving them, isolating them from other whales, and denying them food until they perform the desired behavior. I don't
consider that training, I consider it torture.
They also use captive breeding and then remove young whales from the mother a few weeks after birth, long before they would naturally separate. Anyone
who has observed the close, tactile relationship of gray whales in the Baja lagoons would know how abnormal this is.
I'm a native San Diegan who gave up on sea world many years ago after watching clearly psychotic behavior on display by large intelligent marine
mammals locked in tiny aquariums. It was too disturbing to see these animals in captivity.
I'll pay money to travel to see them in the lagoons or offshore, but never again in tanks.
The new documentary highlights the behavior of an orca that has now killed 3 trainers. Sea World is working hard to disprove the Information. Search
for "Blackfish" for more details but be forewarned, it is gruesome. |
Agreed on the dislike of aquariums!
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shari
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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actually Orcas are dolphins not whales but yeah, they are the macho biker type cetacean for sure...and like some human hunters they attack just for
the fun of it...not because they are hungry.
the propeller cuts werent fresh I dont think because they were white which is scar tissue so they probably werent from that boat...also whales being
attacked by Orcas will try to get under a boat in hopes of staving off an attach...maybe that's what it did
I used to live on my boat anchored out in Oak Bay next to Seaworld in Victoria BC but I had to move because I was so disturbed by Orcas who would hang
around and cry for their loved ones incarcerated behind the net pens...really sad....I just dont buy the logic that whales in captivity are the
ambassadors of the species...it's educational...blah blah blah
free Willy and send him to Asuncion Island to cull some of the sea lions!
[Edited on 7-29-2013 by shari]
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liknbaja127
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Shari, you are the whale lady! Love your posts on this stuff! you are the
ambassador for the whales. cant wait for next year, to see you and your
daughter again. never been to sea world, dont see the need. same for the zoo's. good video!
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shari
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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why thank you...I am already scheduling next seasons trips and look forward to Sirena guiding with me too.
I have been involved in whale protection for over 2 decades which I must say Mexico is more advanced than Canada and the States in that area. I cut my
teeth in whale research learning from my amigos Drs.J im Darling, John Ford and Graeme Ellis who were the first guys to come up with the idea of photo
identifying whales...which came about because Graeme worked as a fisheries observer on Bob Wright's (owner of the aquarium in Victoria) live capture
boats...he was capturing whales right there on Vancouver Island so the captives families would go and visit them. Graeme was sickened by the horrible
method used in rounding up whales, how they injured so many and basically terrorized them.
Graeme had an inkling that there were far less Orcas than they thought there were so he came up with the idea of photo ID'ing them so they could count
them...which they did and they discovered that there were waaaaaay less than they figured...only 330...which made a very strong case for stopping the
live capture there...which they did!!!! Yay team! although now they just go to Iceland or wherever where it is still allowed. Then Mr. Wright went
into the whale watching business with his boats...how ironic eh.
whale harassment is a controversial issue very near to my heart and a very difficult one & hard to enforce...I have been fired at jobs trying to
insist on better protection...bottom line is that whale watching is big business and their first concern is NOT the whales safety. & well being by
any means.
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DianaT
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As I stated, I do have problems with the idea of zoos, but some do serve some good. A good Baja example is the Pronghorn in the Vizcaino that used to
range all the way down the peninsula. On the reserve, there was concern about the gene pool and the Los Angeles Zoo became involved. They came to
the preserve and did genetic testing for the selective breeding program. The Houston Zoo and the San Diego Zoo have also been actively involved in
saving the species.
Then there is the Belize Zoo which is a wonderful place. Orphaned animals were rescued and given a home; orphaned for many reasons including being
used in movies and TV specials. And it is VERY educational about protecting the animals in the wild where orphaned and semi/domesticated or
habituated animals cannot survive.
While it sounds heroic and grandiose to paint all zoos for land and sea animals as HORRIBLE, it ignores a lot of good in the areas of preservation.
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
whale harassment is a controversial issue very near to my heart and a very difficult one & hard to enforce...I have been fired at jobs trying to
insist on better protection...bottom line is that whale watching is big business and their first concern is NOT the whales safety. & well being by
any means. |
Others explain why you were fired very differently --- more than one side to the story.
It appears that at least some of the places in San Ignacio are quite concerned with the safety of the whales, like Kuyima and the many researchers who
are there every year. It is quite controlled.
Yes, whale watching is a money making venture for some, including you. And whale watching is probably what has increased awareness and has helped
saved the whales.
John
[Edited on 7-29-2013 by DianaT]
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willardguy
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don't forget snuffy the seal!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnDH1va7iC0
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Whale-ista
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Sea world protest (video reports)
http://www.10news.com/news/protest-held-outside-seaworld-san...
\"Probably the airplanes will bring week-enders from Los Angeles before long, and the beautiful poor bedraggled old town will bloom with a
Floridian ugliness.\" (John Steinbeck, 1940, discussing the future of La Paz, BCS, Mexico)
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shari
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Mood: there is no reality except the one contained within us "Herman Hesse"
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Yes John..."others" say alot of things...but I was there and know the truth...not the spin that was put on it...and there has been more than one
occasion outside of Mexico where speaking out in defense of whales has not been a popular stance.
I believe whale watching can and is done in a respectful way in many areas and as I said Mexico leads the pack in whale protection regulations. I
agree 100% that experiencing whales in the wild helps raise awareness and save whales. I am not against whale watching by any means but I also know
first hand how it impacts whales...and know that it CAN be done properly if the will is there.
I sold my whale watching company in Canada because I just couldnt bear the increase in pressure on the whales in the feeding grounds...way too many
boats that interfered with feeding by getting in the middle of a feeding pattern....I began to feel guilty about participating in the debacle. Luckily
here in baja, the regulations are generally adhered to which is something to be proud of.
[Edited on 7-29-2013 by shari]
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DianaT
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| Quote: | Originally posted by shari
I sold my whale watching company in Canada because I just couldnt bear the increase in pressure on the whales in the feeding grounds...way too many
boats that interfered with feeding by getting in the middle of a feeding pattern. |
So the pressure from the lawsuit against your business in Canada had nothing to do with it? Did you ever finalize the judgement?
John
[Edited on 7-29-2013 by DianaT]
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shari
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what on earth are you talking about John?
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DianaT
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Shari, your whale watching business in Canada was sued by a client --- don't you remember? You lost the lawsuit. At one time you told us that you
thought it was not a legitimate lawsuit because the pregnant lady was warned that it would be a rough ride, but the court did not see it that way. Is
that when you sold the business and headed for the border?
Law Suit
John
[Edited on 7-29-2013 by DianaT]
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