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Roberto
Banned
Posts: 2162
Registered: 9-5-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Al G
Try as you may, you will not change that. 
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Al, WTF are you talking about? What am I trying to change, and how am I trying to do it?
As far as I know Baja Norte has NEVER been the area between TJ and Maneadero, so I obviously didn't understand the term. There are two states BC
(sometimes erroneously referred to as Baja California Norte) and BCS.
| Quote: |
Everyone using Baja Norte in reference to crime, as all of you know |
Well, not everyone, as I never understood that. But, I'm obviously not as smart as some others here.
[Edited on 12-20-2007 by Roberto]
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tripledigitken
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4848
Registered: 9-27-2006
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For me "Baja Norte" ends when I turn inland from the coast and head up the hills to El Rosario.
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Pescador
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3587
Registered: 10-17-2002
Location: Baja California Sur
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gnukid
Hmmmm. Thinking. Wondering, Observing...
We know the US Federal Government power brokers are criminals-Bush, Cheney, Rumsfelt e.g. is it such a surprise that the power brokers in Mexican
Federal Government are criminals too?
It's all pretty clear. |
You know this is such liberal clap-trap that I am totally offended. In times past we may have disagreed with what someone who was elected to office
may have stood for and what they believed, but now it seems that you are able to be so cool and well informed that you take the liberty to call the
highest elected official in the United States Government a criminal. That really shows your lack of class and education. It is fine to spout the
liberal crap but lets at least show some respect for the office, and then do whatever is necessary to make sure that there is a change in the next
election. That is the mature way of dealing with the issue
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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Baja Norte ends where the US influence runs out and people act as good human beings instead of profit predators.
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CaboRon
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3401
Registered: 3-24-2007
Location: The Valley of the Moon
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Mood: Peacefull
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tripledigitken
For me "Baja Norte" ends when I turn inland from the coast and head up the hills to El Rosario. |
That´s pretty much the way I see it also.
CaboRon
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64589
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Wow, this really is fun to read... This new definition of 'Baja Norte' is quite something, as well!
1) Baja California/ Lower California: is the geographic name of the entire peninsula... often called 'Baja' or 'The Baja' for short (however incorrect
grammatically).
2) The peninsula and the land just north to the American border is divided into two politial divisions (states): The northern half is 'Baja
California' (Lower California) and the southern half (south of the 28th parallel) has 'Sur' added: 'Baja California Sur' (Southern Lower California).
3) Because people like to abbreviate, Baja California becomes 'Baja' and Baja California Sur becomes 'Baja Sur'.
4) To make sure there is no confusion or to be specific as to which half of the 'Baja' peninsula one is refering... the northen half is often refered
to as 'Baja Norte'.
I think to make new definitions that 'Baja Norte' is only the part of the northern half that is north of Maneadero or north of El Rosario's boojum
hills is asking for a lot of geographical confusion, don't you?
How about calling the busy section nearest the border 'LA FRONTERA' as the Mexicans do, to indicate the land closest to the border... or in gringo
terms, within 80-100 miles of the border. I mean with all the gunfire... it is like a FRONTIER ZONE!
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Mexitron
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3397
Registered: 9-21-2003
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
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Mood: Happy!
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I agree DK--La Frontera is more appropriate.
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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| Quote: | Originally posted by tripledigitken
For me "Baja Norte" ends when I turn inland from the coast and head up the hills to El Rosario. |
I too feel this as I did feel my mood change...and I do know many refer to Baja California as Baja Norte. Many also assume when you say Baja Norte it
is Tijuana to Ensenada. I think we should be careful in saying Baja Norte that we make people understand the Major corrupt Cops and criminals are in
this area...there is no reason yet for the people from Santo Tomas south to pay the price for the crime in Baja Norte....or should everyone just call
it "Baja Norte Gauntlet"
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
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Mood: Wondering what is next???
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I concede to DK's "La Frontera Gauntlet"
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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livencabo
Junior Nomad
Posts: 43
Registered: 11-18-2007
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For me the "code of silence" has been observed by the US Department of State, failing to issue strong travel advisories, the travel industry and land
developers who paint Baja as a Paradise where the docile natives welcome your presence with unconditional hospitality. The truth has always been that
foreigners from any country traveling in any country are easy targets for the criminal element.
Drugs are not new in Baja. End of discussion.
During my 15 years in BCS I have made friends and also have been the frequent object of random racist comments against gringos. So, I am used to
expressing my opinions and either being misunderstood or meeting with insults from those who strongly disagree with me. No problema!
I did not welcome the changes that have occurred. I don't think a boycott will improve conditions in the delicate balance of a region on the verge of
social upheaval. I think I grasp better than most the gravity of the situation. I only rent my house and am very hesitant about declaring the
permanent residency or citizenship for which I am now eligible. I am, in fact prepared to give away everything I have acquired here and leave. That
is how serious I am about current develpments.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9006
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Mood: Inquisitive
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I think we're agreeing Grover.
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Packoderm
Super Nomad
Posts: 2116
Registered: 11-7-2002
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I agree.
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losfrailes
Senior Nomad
Posts: 577
Registered: 11-16-2004
Location: Ejido San Lucas near Santa Rosalia
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Mood: Good!
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Holy s h i t! What is it, something you are smoking, reading or eating.
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Gypsy Jan
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4275
Registered: 1-27-2004
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Mood: Depends on which way the wind is blowing
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Fear-Mongering Jingoism
Anything Carrie Duncan publishes is designed to drive traffic and business to her worthless rag of a publication.
She has decent people working for her who give it its life, but her warped and twisted version of Mexico and ethical journalism still poison the
publication.
Fact One: She highjacked the name "Gringo Gazette" from a longtime alt newspaper in Long Beach, CA, with the trademarked name "Grunion Gazette".
Fact Two: I heard, first hand, her speak about how she caters to the "baseball-capped, idiot Americans that move to Cabo". She said that she makes
her money enhancing their fears of the locals. She despises the Mexican people on all fronts and bragged about taking more than a million dollars
tax-free every year out of the country.
The Gringo Gazette South is about a reliable news source as, well, I don't know, maybe astrological forecasts.
[Edited on 12-20-2007 by Gypsy Jan]
“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow mindedness.”
—Mark Twain
\"La vida es dura, el corazon es puro, y cantamos hasta la madrugada.” (Life is hard, the heart is pure and we sing until dawn.)
—Kirsty MacColl, Mambo de la Luna
\"Alea iacta est.\"
—Julius Caesar
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Alan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1617
Registered: 4-6-2005
Location: Yucaipa, CA/La Paz
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I particularly enjoyed the discussions defining Baja Norte and Baja Sur. Obviously it depends upon the datum used for reference just as selecting a
different datum in your GPS can drastically change your position on the globe. For some that use the legal description as their datum, Baja Norte
starts north of the 28th parallel. For those whose attitude changes with latitude, the border is somewhere around El Rosario. For others it is the
high-risk corridor between TJ and Ensenada. If you change your datum to census results, Baja Norte begins just south of the Oregon border
I understand the frustration expressed on both sides of this argument. Does it really matter whether this situation is caused by drug cartels,
organized crime or corrupt officials? As gringos, a boycott of the high-risk area, defined using the datum of YOUR choice, is the ONLY active measure
available to us. Other than the hyperbole in press releases and the wringing of hands, a gringo boycott is the only measure currently being
implemented. Is it the best solution? Of course not! Everyone is hurt by it. Unfortunately it is the ONLY option available to us and SOMETHING
needs to be done. Ideally it will encourage those who have other options to implement them.
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6699
Registered: 9-5-2003
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by gnukid
. I am not leaving Mexico. I am mexican.
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rts551
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6699
Registered: 9-5-2003
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GNU
You have no credibility. You say you are Mexican (and can't leave Mexico) but a review of your past posts indicate you reside on a FM-3, use a US
cell phone etc. Which is it?
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Gnukid, I think you're a good guy. I also think your thoughts here, expressions about your world-view are too broad for this forum, this thread. You
keep referring to Mexico. This peninsula is a part of Mexico but it sure as hell ain't "Mexico". If you speak Spanish in these little villages
you'll be accepted with all the love and warmth they usually give chilangos. If you offer your polite advice and support you will be seen as a medler
who could not possibly know the customs, the culture, the history or the local landscape enought to give anything of value. Now go back out there in
your neighborhood and find out exactly what they think of your love and good will. Some of us would read some brand new messages from you aimed at
things in Baja California, not Mexico.
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Santiago
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3502
Registered: 8-27-2003
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Osprey
This peninsula is a part of Mexico but it sure as hell ain't "Mexico". If you speak Spanish in these little villages you'll be accepted with all the
love and warmth they usually give chilangos. If you offer your polite advice and support you will be seen as a medler who could not possibly know the
customs, the culture, the history or the local landscape enought to give anything of value. |
Osprey: Can you give a few examples of what the differences are between baja and the mainland. Or do you mean just the DF? Thanks
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Osprey
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3694
Registered: 5-23-2004
Location: Baja Ca. Sur
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Sure, these Cholleros are very tribal, insular, rustic and proud. I'm sure you can see and feel the vast difference in lifestyles/opinions, etc
between the people of small-town Idaho and, say, those of long time residence in Los Angeles or San Franciso. Baja California is unique, maybe
Mexico's Madagascar or the U.S.'s Hawaii or Alaska. In some of these small villages a man who moved there 30 years ago is "The New Guy". Takes them
generations to learn the customs familiar to a canyon, region, village.
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