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larryC
Super Nomad
Posts: 1499
Registered: 8-11-2008
Location: BoLA
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This morning they are gone. I don't think they are malicious, they probably just check their e-mail. But who knows, they may also download a movie,
and that plays havoc with my FAP limit.
Larry
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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UN-Malicious Cruisers
It's probably TRUE that the Majority of the Cruising Community are Not Malicious.
Most are NOT thieves, but Most ARE Freeloaders.
The difficulty is knowing which.
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monoloco
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6667
Registered: 7-13-2009
Location: Pescadero BCS
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When they hack someone's password they cease being a freeloader and become a thief.
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
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Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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Philosophically and Legally Speaking
Well, of course, those hackers are Thieves on the Philosophical question, but legally, Quien Sabe ?
Laws "Attempting" to address that question in the U.S. have encountered a Rocky Road (because of the provable LOSS question) with, often, the result
being that they were vacated UNLESS the person was actually ON the Victim's property.
It got to the point where the Freeloaders were not only trolling down the street and parking in front of the victim's house, but pulling into private
driveways.
Generally speaking (absent Trespass), the burden has been determined to be on the Network Owners to protect their signal. Which, of course, is more
and more difficult. It wasn't long after it became fairly easy to crack WEP that WPA was exposed. I haven't read anything lately, so I'm "assuming"
that WPA-2 is still safe.
Commercial users (who charge) such as Campgrounds and Motels that I've utilized have gone to "Portals" which require an access key that has been
enabled or C.C., but that, of course, is not something that those simply sharing their signals would resort to.
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BajaGringo
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3922
Registered: 8-24-2006
Location: La Chorera
Member Is Offline
Mood: Let's have a BBQ!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
Most are NOT thieves, but Most ARE Freeloaders.
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My opinion of the two are just about the same...
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Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaGringo
| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
Most are NOT thieves, but Most ARE Freeloaders.
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My opinion of the two are just about the same... |
True!
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Jack Swords
Super Nomad
Posts: 1095
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: Nipomo, CA/La Paz, BCS
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I pondered whether to chime in on this thread or not. As a member of the Nomads since dirt and a part of the cruising community for the past 13
years, one must surely realize that all groups have their "freeloaders" and "thieves". The diversity among cruisers is similar to that of the members
of this board. Literally thousands of dollars have been poured into charities in La Paz and Loreto as a result of fund-raising by cruiser groups.
Members of the Nomads have also enthusiastically supported those in need. As a traveler in Mexico we have experienced folks camped for months on
beaches living on very little income. Now those beaches and the camping is drying up as we see more and more development. The same is true with
cruisers. Years ago one's boat could anchor for months in a cove with little money spent. Now, new marinas are springing up and charge the same for
a slip as one would pay in the U.S. Anchoring, which used to be free, is charged by the day in many places in Baja (like La Paz Bay). More charges
are coming. Yes, there are freeloaders on land and sea, but that is changing rapidly. No longer can a free spirit go to Mexico on so-many dollars a
day. That these three boats are up in the Sea is interesting as Bay Fest is going on in La Paz for this week. Apparently they are not participating.
(Google Club Cruceros to see what's going on)
Marina de la Paz several years ago put in wi-fi for their clients. So many bootleggers tapped into the system (at anchor, parked on adjacent streets)
that it was overloaded and useless. Finally wire was strung to each and every slip in the marina to enable client use of the Internet. At sea, well
prepared boaters (cruisers) use Pactor over HF radios to e-mail on the Internet. It works quite well.
The cruising community I have been acquainted with, both in the U.S. and the Sea of Cortez have been generous to a fault. Are there some jerks? Sure,
but no more than one experiences anywhere in this life. Drop by, swim out, say hello and meet some nice folks. You'll probably be greeted with a
glass of wine or a beer, and maybe dinner. Cruisers usually have a thorough first-aid kit and reliable radio communications both locally and back to
the states. Keep this in mind as we wander into those isolated spots.
Bill: I put wi-fi on my boat and use WEP and WPA-2. I appreciate your knowledge and input. Always learning something.
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bufeo
Senior Nomad
Posts: 793
Registered: 11-16-2003
Location: Santa Fe New Mexico
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Jack,
I'm glad you posted that. As a former 'cruiser' (44' trawler) and a former 'anchored-on-land' Baja resident I concur with your comment.
Allen R
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1856
Registered: 3-9-2009
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BillM, I set up security on my wireless network by only allowing PCs that are put on a list in my router. That list requires the net bios name and
the MAC address. None of the user PCs that is on the list has to use a password to get onto the network, just boot the PC and start the browser. Is
this what you are calling 'MAC' restriction?
If so, is MAC restriction, in fact, better than WEP or WPA-2 security? I mean, I am thinking that if you are disallowed from access on my router
because I haven't entered your PC's worldwide unique MAC address on my list of permitted users, how in hell can you get on my wireless network? I was
hoping that it would be absolutely impossible for a non-listed PC to get on my network. Am I wrong?
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absinvestor
Senior Nomad
Posts: 725
Registered: 11-28-2009
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Hacking a password is something different but up until a couple of years ago when we traveled we always would search for an unprotected wi-fi site to
check email etc. We would usually find a connection outside a library, school or large business. The wi-fi at our house has one set price for
unlimited access and downloads and we assumed that our using anothers wi-fi didn't cost them anything. In 2009 we found out different. We were staying
at a campground in Mississippi that didn't have internet. I spoke to another camper who said that the local library had wi-fi. We were in a really
small town and the library had a really small parking lot. We drove around the block looking for a parking space and my wife commented that she was
picking up wi-fi from a school. We found a parking spot in front of the school on the street. I trade stocks and that evening I returned to the same
spot to do my internet work. The next morning we returned for the 3rd time and while I was getting online stock quotes the principal of the school
walked up to the motorhome and asked me what I was doing. I told her I was using their wi-fi to get some stock quotes and she just smiled and said a
couple of the students had seen us there two or three times and she was curious. She told us to have a nice day and went back inside the school. Less
than 5 minutes later the local sheriff pulled up behind the motorhome and walked up to the drivers window. He asked me what I was doing and I told
him. He started to read me the riot act saying I was stealing and I was commiting a felony etc etc. I told him that the principal knew and she didn't
seem to have a problem with it to which the sheriff told me it was the principal who called him!! He told me not to move and that he was going inside
to see if the principal wanted to press charges!! After waiting about 10 minutes he came back out and told me the principal didn't want to press
charges. He told me to leave and not return!! Someone hacking a password should know better but I wonder how many people use others wi-fi without
knowing they may be using a limited supply of download time etc etc. (Last year when camping at Daggetts campground in Bahia de Los Angeles one of the
campers was sitting on top of his trailer saying he was picking up wifi from one of the surrounding houses/'businesses. ) At our house I only use a
password to protect my personal info- Is it possible the sailboaters don't realize they are "stealing" limited download access from the owners and
since they are not trying to "steal" bank info etc don't realize they are doing anything wrong?? (I only say this because I would never have
intentionally stolen time from a library, school or individual but I did it out of a lack of knowledge.) Granted the camper in Bahia de Los Angeles
wasn't trying to hack into a protected site but he certainly wasn't trying to hide what he was doing. There wasn't anyway for him to determine which
house/ business had the unprotected site so how would he "ask for permission?" I'm confident that he didn't realize that he was doing anything
wrong.
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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MAC Restriction
We're talking about the same thing.
MediaAccessControl
12-Digit Hexadecimal ID for Wireless Devices.
Reading up just now on the MAC spoofing, it is relatively simple, however, it appears that to spoof onto a restricted network, you'd need to know one
of the allowed MACs. Not something that those cruisers would have access to.
[Edited on 4-8-2011 by MrBillM]
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1856
Registered: 3-9-2009
Member Is Offline
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Absinvestor,
The officer was going to possibly arrest you, possibly haul you off right then, charge you with some crime for what you were doing. No one on Wall
Street has been incarcerated for the latest national/worldwide financial collapse when they were directly the cause.
Trillions in losses Vs use of some band width.
No consequences Vs charge you with a crime.
Wierd, isn't it?
[Edited on 4-9-2011 by MitchMan]
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Jim/Liisa
Nomad
Posts: 192
Registered: 2-5-2011
Location: San Felipe (South Campos)
Member Is Offline
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Ahhh, some thing about Hughesnet brings out the best in people. They SUCK but you can't live with out them in Mexico. Tried to see if I could get some
fellow nieghbers at my campo to form a group conected to one dish and and split the cost. Of course this is after I had offered to pay to have use of
Another nieghber for sevice to check emails. Didn't get any where. FAP CRAP is the whole problem...
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Russ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6742
Registered: 7-4-2004
Location: Punta Chivato
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
We're talking about the same thing.
MediaAccessControl
12-Digit Hexadecimal ID for Wireless Devices.
Reading up just now on the MAC spoofing, it is relatively simple, however, it appears that to spoof onto a restricted network, you'd need to know one
of the allowed MACs. Not something that those cruisers would have access to.
[Edited on 4-8-2011 by MrBillM] |
When the jacked me they went into my wireless and disabled the security so MAC was not an issue for them.
Bahia Concepcion where life starts...given a chance!
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fishabductor
Senior Nomad
Posts: 800
Registered: 5-29-2010
Member Is Offline
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People in remote areas pay dearly for internet via satelite. it is not cheap to buy the equipment or the service. Most people buy the smallest
broadband width they can and make it work. No downloading videos or music for some, others buy a bigger package and share it between a few houses.
There is a big difference between the unlimited dsl/broadband in the states and what we have out here in the boonies. The equipement alone will set
you back about a minimum of $2k when bought/installed in baja...some systems are $6k! and a few hundred a month.
Where we live, we have no phone service (cell or landline) or no TV(don't care for it), so internet is both our communication(email, magicjack, skype)
as well as our entertainment. Given this you can understand why we don't like it stolen..ours is protected and the code is changed regularly.
[Edited on 4-9-2011 by fishabductor]
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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Amazed ?
I, too, am amazed at how many Networks I find unprotected. At one time (in Baja) strictly for recreation since I had (and have) my own Hughesnet
access, I put up an external 16db antenna and trolled connections. Found 8-9 and 5 were unprotected. Most lately have changed.
Up North, there are 5 nearby (using only a 6db indoors antenna), but only one unsecured.
Working on systems for others, I'm even more amazed at those I find with the router setup still at the default "admin-password". DUH !
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1856
Registered: 3-9-2009
Member Is Offline
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Russ,
How in the heck does anyone get into your router if you use MAC restriction?
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absinvestor
Senior Nomad
Posts: 725
Registered: 11-28-2009
Member Is Offline
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To MitchMan- And that Sheriff was serious. When I told him that I was told the library had free internet but I couldn't find parking he yelled "son,
this ain't the library, this here is the high school!!! My wife doesn't drive the motorhome so had he decided to take me in, it would have been a
mess!! At our next stop I parked on the street, found an unprotected connection that was listed to a hardware store. I went inside the store and asked
if they had a problem if I connected. They looked at me like I was crazy and said "no problem lots of people use our connection."
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1856
Registered: 3-9-2009
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When in La Paz and I need an internet connection, I just take my laptop into the downtown area, find a place to sit down and log on to any unsecured
connection I can get. There are usually about 9 possible connections and at least 33% are not password protected. Usually because there are
restaurants or coffee shops in the area that offer it free to their customers.
I figure if the owner/administrator of the connection doesn't know about wifi securitization or if he/she doesn't bother to implement it, it couldn't
be much of a concern to him/her that some stranger like me would log on and use some of their bandwidth, much less their even being able to notice it.
I only use the internet while in Baja to check email, make calls via Skype, visit this forum, check currency rates, or to look some info up. I never
ever access my checking accounts...never, while in Mexico.
I think it is all very innocuous stuff. Even in law, generally, if you cause no actual harm, there is no infraction.
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
Member Is Offline
Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
I, too, am amazed at how many Networks I find unprotected. At one time (in Baja) strictly for recreation since I had (and have) my own Hughesnet
access, I put up an external 16db antenna and trolled connections. Found 8-9 and 5 were unprotected. Most lately have changed.
Up North, there are 5 nearby (using only a 6db indoors antenna), but only one unsecured.
Working on systems for others, I'm even more amazed at those I find with the router setup still at the default "admin-password". DUH !
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