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surabi
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I can't take anyone seriously who says "wind and solar farms don't work".
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RFClark
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Wind and solar don’t work as base load unless they are interconnected with large storage systems. The experience of South Australia being a prime
and well documented example.
Take that seriously!
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pacificobob
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I couldn't agree more surabi. The ignorance of the science denying fossil fuel fascists...is hard to conceal.
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Don Pisto
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Mood: weary like everyone else
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consider the knuckleheads you're arguing with....why even bother?
there's only two things in life but I forget what they are........
John Hiatt
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RFClark
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Yes,
Noor is an integrated system. Which is great. Piecemeal solar and wind need huge amounts of storage to be reliable sources (base load).
Ontario Hydro is a good base load example because they have sufficient nuclear to cover their base load most of the time and when hydro is included,
all of the time. In order to deal with peak loads they can start, modulate, or stop their other sources. Nuclear as currently implemented is generally
on or off. Load or turbine trips in their lite water reactors “poison” the reactor for several days before it can be restarted.
A similar system for distributed green sources can currently best be met by pumped water impoundment (pumping water uphill to a large storage lake and
then allowing it to flow back through the pumps which are now generators)
DWP in Los Angeles has had a system of this sort in place for decades. They had 3 - 10MW Hitachi turbo pumps that pumped water from Castiac lake up to
Pyramid lake and return. The system predates large scale solar and wind. It originally used the Pacific Inter-tie to supply virtually free electricity
from Hydro systems that had water flow requirements at night when loads were lite.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by RFClark]
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JZ
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I suggest you listen to this guy who has worked on trying make renewables successful his entire life.
The problems are cost, use of land, energy storage, etc.
https://youtu.be/N-yALPEpV4w?si=RG1MyH8_Pb9mLSsW
And in before someone posts some rag attacking the messenger, not the message.
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RFClark
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DP,
The “Knuckleheads” are those who’s engineering skills are limited to operating mechanical light switches generalizing about replacing base load
generating capacity with green systems that are just beginning to have storage attached to them. Think Tesla here! Also think in about 10 years.
You did notice that the “adults” such as they are extended the operating life of Diablo Canyon because even they could see the looming disaster!
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RFClark
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Early Major Snowfall in Greenland
https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/148826/unusual-snow...
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surabi
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There are problems associated with any technology. It's a matter of weighing the problems against the benefits.
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RFClark
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The problem is not just with the limits of technology. The problem is also with the limits of people's understanding of the limits of technology.
Not understanding those limits makes it impossible to accurately forecast the actual benefits prior to investing in a new technology.
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JZ
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Solar is fantastic for home and personal use. Not for the grid.
EV's are great for dense city environments. Not great for some other uses.
The problem is EV's being rammed down peoples' throats before the tech or infrastructure are ready for it.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by JZ]
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RFClark
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JZ,
We can do something about the climate. We have the technology to reduce the amount of sunlight.
What we don’t have is the worldwide agreement to do it. We also have a large group of people that for a variety of reasons don’t want to see that
done.
In the end climate control won’t be attempted until and unless things actually get far worse.
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caj13
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Quote: Originally posted by JZ  | Solar is fantastic for home and personal use. Not for the grid.
EV's are great for dense city environments. Not great for some other uses.
The problem is EV's being rammed down peoples' throats before the tech or infrastructure are ready for it.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by JZ] |
and exactly who has had buying an EV rammed down their throat? anyone here?
Exactly - so JZ - your statement destroys whatever credibility you might think you have! - it's clearly biased BS -which you spout trying to self
justify your opinion (which is obviously not backed by actual fact)
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caj13
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| Quote: Originally posted by JZ | Solar is fantastic for home and personal use. Not for the grid.
EV's are great for dense city environments. Not great for some other uses.
The problem is EV's being rammed down peoples' throats before the tech or infrastructure are ready for it.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by JZ] |
Lets see - My college reduced their Electric Bill by 2/3 just by putting up solar panel sun shades in the parking lots - it paid for itself in less
than 3 years - So - no - its not personal or home use - its big time commercial use hooked to the grid- how is that? JZ - care to elaborate?
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
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| Quote: Originally posted by JZ |
The problem is EV's being rammed down peoples' throats before the tech or infrastructure are ready for it.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by JZ] |
I have several friends who drive EVs. It wasn't "rammed down their throats", it was their considered choice. All of them are totally pleased with
having made that choice. They have not experienced any issues with the tech or infrastructure.
When people like you refuse to care about the common good, and look for any excuse to justify their self-concerned attitude and world view, be it
refusing to wear a mask during a pandemic, sneaking your dog into a no-pets hotel, or clinging to your fossil fuel burning vehicles or guns like a
security blanket, that which is necessary to benefit society and the environment as a whole have to be "rammed down your throat". People who do the
right thing without being forced to don't have these fears of being controlled.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by surabi]
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RFClark
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“ People who do the right thing without being forced to don't have these fears of being controlled.”
You’ll have to stipulate which jurisdiction your “the right thing” to do was issued by. It’s not the same in Canada, the US, or Mexico. If you
lived or even visited Iran “the right thing” would to wear a headscarf! (Or at least the safe thing!)
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mtgoat666
Select Nomad
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| Quote: Originally posted by JZ |
The problem is EV's being rammed down peoples' throats before the tech or infrastructure are ready for it.
[Edited on 10-30-2023 by JZ] |
Half pint,
You reaction of resistance to and fear of change is natural amongst your aging peer group. You are old and set in your ways, and your inelastic brain
reacts to change with anger and fear.
You should not worry, be happy. You will likely be able to drive ice vehicles until the day you die.
Your kids will be buying e vehicles. Maybe they will show you how they work, hold your hand, help you past your fears.
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
Super Nomad
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Goat,
I don’t know if you're old but that generalization is wrong!
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JZ
Elite Nomad
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A must watch. Getting worried for the mental health of these people.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mqiog8u6sgo
[Edited on 10-31-2023 by JZ]
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RFClark
Super Nomad
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When “science” becomes unquestionable dogma it stops being “science” and becomes “religion”.
The “good news” is they are going to screw around until weather modification is the only choice.
Note that China is building lots of near current sea level stuff in the South China Sea. What do you imagine it will do if that investment is
threatened? In fact China just banned all private networked weather stations in china! Weather data is a state secret!
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