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surabi
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That's all very interesting science research, but you still haven't explained how you think this could be some useful thing regarding climate change.
And do you not understand how everything is interconnected? Does it not occur to you that even if we could extract water from 400 miles below the
earth's crust, that extracting it could cause some other dire consequence? Also it isn't water- it's water trapped in a mineral.
Talking about something that has no relation to solving climate change problems now or even in my grandkids' lifetime, is rather pointless as anything
but scientific curiosity.
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RFClark
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S,
Crickets - crickets - crickets still on Hansen’s paper! Who would have thought he would turn out to be the Martin Luther of Human Climate Change?
You can’t make this stuff up!
On other subjects, you obviously don’t understand this paper. It’s not about us humans doing anything! It’s about us humans discovering that the
earth’s natural water cycle used in our current climate models is incomplete so it’s forecasts are incomplete.
If you think that this has nothing to do with now watch Iceland and Italy. Both are due volcanic eruptions, possibly very large ones. Those eruptions
do effect the climate in real time. Think those sulfur compounds in the air that you loath here.
It is believed that this deep hydrated zone plays a major part of the natural carbon (think CO2 here) as well as the water cycle. It’s a very
important part of how the earth’s climate works and constantly changes.
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surabi
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Blah blah blah. How about never mind the "forecasts"- there are catastrophic things happening right now, in real time. The glaciers are melting, the
rivers are running low, the ocean level is rising, this year we just had the hottest months on record, an unprecedented numbers and intensity of
wildfires, and the heat has been rising for years, the strength and number of hurricanes has increased, terrible flooding has increased.
Those aren't forecasts. But carry on living in your metal box bubble.
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RFClark
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S,
Still more dogma and crickets. Hansen says some of your solutions likely will make things worse not better. Make it hotter not cooler!
Those things you mention like the sea rising have been occurring these last 12,000 plus years to the sum of 150,000mm sea level rise, 80mm of which
have occurred since 1995. All of it was caused by melting ice.
The US and China met today if China’s 50% contribution to climate change was discussed it wasn’t mentioned in the press coverage.
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mtgoat666
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When i see the stupidity and cruelty of my fellow humans, i sometimes think maybe life on earth will be better for all species when evolution marches
on and homo sapiens is replaced by one or more species.
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
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Goat, I think you’ll be disappointed with the results!
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surabi
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Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  | S,
Those things you mention like the sea rising have been occurring these last 12,000 plus years to the sum of 150,000mm sea level rise, 80mm of which
have occurred since 1995. All of it was caused by melting ice.
The US and China met today if China’s 50% contribution to climate change was discussed it wasn’t mentioned in the press coverage.
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As for that first statement, so what? That's just more of your blah blah. So what if something has been going on for a long time? That doesn't negate
the fact that the rate has been accelerating or reached a critical stage. By your line of reasoning, that someone has become obese, which is impacting
their health, is no big deal, and nothing to be concerned about because they've been slowly but steadily gaining weight over the past 3 decades.
As for your second statement, perhaps you should expand your choice of "press coverage".
https://apnews.com/article/climate-china-us-apec-methane-522...
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by surabi]
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RFClark
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S,
“Crickets still on Hansen’s paper! Who would have thought he would turn out to be the Martin Luther of Human Climate Change? You can’t make this
stuff up!”
Can’t deal with it cause your dogma won’t let you! Just blah-blah-blah, my head is stuck in the ground. I can’t hear you!
With history as a guide Hansen will probably get what Luther got for his effort. People with closely held beliefs are very touchy when they’re
questioned.
I’ll let you read the 2 quotes and “discover” the difference! If I named those not discussing the danger posed to the world by climate change
yesterday it would be “politics”. “Climate Change” being the world’s major issue it’s fair to note that the 2 participants didn’t
mention or take credit for “The Agreement(s)”? Oh, excuse me not agreements just “pledges”.
“China and the US pledge to step up climate efforts ahead of Biden-Xi summit and UN meeting”
“The US and China met today if China’s 50% contribution to climate change was discussed it wasn’t mentioned in the press coverage.”
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: Originally posted by RFClark | S,
“Crickets still on Hansen’s paper! Who would have thought he would turn out to be the Martin Luther of Human Climate Change? You can’t make this
stuff up!”
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You post lots of stuff, most of it from questionable websites. Don't make us click on your tik toks and other foreign links of dubious nature. Why
don’t you post the abstract here so we know what you are rambling on about…
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
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Goat,
Really? Not a single quote from Fox News:
Apple News - News Service World Wide
Science.org
Nature.com
TheGuardian.com
Inside Climate News - source for the Hansen news
Right Wing Rags All. I’ve never seen a goat with its head in the sand but it must be possable.
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: Originally posted by RFClark | Goat,
Really? Not a single quote from Fox News:
Apple News - News Service World Wide
Science.org
Nature.com
TheGuardian.com
Inside Climate News - source for the Hansen news
Right Wing Rags All. I’ve never seen a goat with its head in the sand but it must be possable.
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark] |
Still don't know what you’re talking about. Are you referring to the pop science article you read about water content in the earth’s mantle?
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
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Goat,
No, here’s the paper’s abstract $15 to read the paper.
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.1253358
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mtgoat666
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4 authors on that paper, and none named Hansen!
The topic of this thread is anthropogenic climate/sea level change (and david k’s family photo album),… the paper you cite (Dehydration melting at
the top of the lower mantle) has nothing to do with the price of tea in China!
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by mtgoat666]
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
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Goat,
So what you really want is my source for Hansen’s statements that removing the sulphur from the air is causing the temperatures to rise faster.
Inside Climate News is a major climate news source. Link to articles below one of which quotes Hansen on the subject.
https://arstechnica.com/author/insideclimatenews/
https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/11/former-head-of-nasas...
Here’s more reading on the aerosol issue,
https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/05/wildfire-smoke-from-...
Remember that Murphy is totally apolitical in metering out punishment for sloppy science and crappy engineering.
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
[Edited on 11-16-2023 by RFClark]
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mtgoat666
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Clarkles:
Still waiting for you to explain the link between anthropogenic global warming and water content of the earth’s mantle!
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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RFClark
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Goat,
Different subject. There are citations for all of this, no I won’t post them as few, possibly including you will read any of this.
Start with the fact that for more than 70% of the earth we don’t have much good data prior to about 1995. Things are so bad that Grad Students are
manually entering weather information derived from reading paper ship logs. Especially for the Pacific Ocean.
The Climate People are trying to forecast 70+ years into the future based on less than 30 years of reasonable good data. There is also a profound lack
of understanding of what the cycles even are and how they work.
It turns out that a new AI weather forecaster running on a single super computer is now generating better 10 day weather forecasts much faster
(minutes not hours) not using reams of weather data but weather satellite images. So there is hope going forward
Major players
CO2: most living non-plants generate it, most plants require it. A majority of earth’s CO2 is stored in a variety of sinks, both long and short term
outside of the atmosphere. The Oceans being a major short term sink. The cycle times and budgets for CO2 are not well understood
Methane: We are just in the first stages of developing a methane budget for the earth. The fight about organic vs inorganic methane is ongoing.
Everyone agrees that there’s methane hydrates on the sea floor but no agreement on how much methane also leaks from the ground as well as the sea
floor in quantities only now being measured.
Sulfur compounds: again both organic and inorganic sources. The first satellite to monitor some of these compounds in the atmosphere launches next
year, primarily thanks to Hansen. Volcanos release much of these compounds along with internal combustion engines which burn hydrocarbons. Again the
cycle time and budget is not well understood.
Smoke and aerosols : Organic and inorganic sources, Volcanos, Fires, various wind blown substances including NaCl and bacteria. All of which support
cloud formation and directly modulate the amount of insolation received and held by the earth. Very complicated cycle times and budgets not well
defined or measured yet.
Above are just 3 classes out of many that modulate the earth’s climate. The Sun and Orbital forcing also have cycles that modulate our climate.
Then there is Man who has modulated the earth’s climate since he started using fire long ago.
The point of the deep ground water discovery paper is we now find that there could be 4 times as much water in play affecting these cycles and the
climate as we previously thought we knew about.
It’s a poorly understood complicated dynamic system that we need to modify and monitor in real time. Just do something now won’t cut it nor will
dogma! This isn’t a forest just following your footsteps backwards won’t get you out again.
Hansen’s paper already points out the negative consequences of some of our “improvements”.
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AKgringo
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Water vapor is still the leading greenhouse gas, and warm air is capable of holding more water vapor than cold air.
If you are not living on the edge, you are taking up too much space!
"Could do better if he tried!" Report card comments from most of my grade school teachers. Sadly, still true!
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RFClark
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Ak,
That is the point I was trying to make water is the solvent that drives the cycles the other things are generally impurities in the water.
Finding that we only know about part of the H2O cycle and 25% of the water is huge.
It’s like finally accepting that continents actually drift when I was a teen. My lifelong friend’s dad was the Chair of the Geology Dept at a
major LA University and a major part of the continental drift debate.
There are people, some very well educated who are incapable of changing their worldviews even unto their deaths. They simply can’t process the
information that conflicts with what they know that they know. Usually it’s necessary to wait for them to retire before progress can be made.
Not a few such people went down with the Titanic because they couldn't process what they could see with their own eyes.
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BajaMama
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Look at the evidence. Don't bother with pundit opinions. Look at the world around you to decide whether climate change, global warming, rising seas
are happening. Read and make sense of information, data and facts that come your way.
Are storms getting stronger? Are weather patterns shifting? Are fires bigger, more frequent and more destructive?
And most importantly, remember that A LOT of data conclusion is skewed to fit a point of view. And a lot of people who read good data do so with a
bias.
But for the sake of all that is holy, stop bickering at each other because your conclusions are different. A photo of a normal tidal ebb and flow, or
a storm surge that reaches the beach is not evidence of CC or GW.
However, glaciers disappearing at the current unprecedented rate does speak volumes. The disappearance of ice at the poles is happening faster than
predicted with CC and GW data. Do what you want with that, I don't care. Just look at the data, the facts, the evidence. Make your own conclusions.
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RFClark
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BajaM,
The only point I’m trying to make is what the Climate Scolds want to do isn’t the right thing and even if it was it’s not enough to do more than
“rearrange the deckchairs on the Titanic”.
Read what a top climate scientist thinks.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/11/former-head-of-nasas...
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